Any Rinseless Washes 4 Coatings?

At this risk of being too controversial, what is the big deal that ECH2O and Uber (or others) leave stuff behind?

Yes, yes. If your coating beads and with ECH2O and Uber it now sheets or vice versa, it changes the "behavior" of your coating (or sealant or wax). I don`t see how this really is a bad thing. Visually, I can`t tell a difference between my car (coated with Mohs) washed with Mr. Pink or Xtreme Foam or when it`s washed with Uber. Washed with both, my car beads and sheets the same. There can`t be THAT much of a behavior change that is detrimental to the car.

Perhaps some people put on coatings and sealants for cosmetic reasons, but aren`t we all on at least one level putting a LSP on to protect the paint? If Uber and ECH2O leave stuff behind, isn`t that leaving -- however miniscule -- additional layers of protection?

Personally, I think the safest product would allow the most sheeting -- get the water off the car. We have these threads -- post your beading shots -- because we like beads and all their hydrophobic goodness. But beads stay put. They dry up. So, I could see why one wouldn`t want a product that beads and sheets instead. But I look at it in terms of protection. More layers = good.

(This excludes discussion about washing before applying a LSP, etc. The above is more about maintenance washing.)
 
kevincwelch said:
Gotcha. I see the OP`s intention after rereading.

Explain: clogging the coating
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Coatings (as I understand) are not flat...... They are more striated, to be self cleaning and hydrophobic. Adding stuff on top, "clogs" this.

Hopefully Mike will jump in and explain it better.
 
yes, I once asked Todd H about the literal science behind PBL and the top of the surface left behind as a result of a layer and never really got a full answer to satisfy my scientific curiosity...

I`d be interested in hearing from someone who knows about this as well.

I can logically see the side Ron is alluding to, as that would logically explain the "clogging" effect but I also thought of a coating as creating a smooth molecular surface, so I guess I am confused...hence why I`d like some explanation. As detailed as possible is preferable....I like to learn more.
 
JBM said:
I have just about every rinseless out there, I use them all without thinking twice and none of them have affected the CQUK on my vehicles.

Gary Dead has a new coating/wash/spray system that will make the coating last forever with the system. Launching in March officially.

Reps for optimum say you can paint over a dried ONR vehicle without bonding issues.
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Whatever ONR leaves, it ain`t a whole lot. Certainly not like Uber and UWW.
 
I may be completely off base here, but this is what I have read (and possibly misunderstand).

Coatings do two things: they fill a variable geometry space with small molecules to create a physical filler and create a hydrophobic surface. There is some bonding with the substrate. This is what produces the glossy reflective nature of a coated surface - more uniform surface for reflection. That`s the physical space. The restructuring results in an arrangement of smoothly lined particles. But, perhaps, on a nano scale, there is some corrugation to this. The hydrophobicity depends upon the molecular make-up of the coating (silica, titania) and how those molecules interact with each other and repel polar molecules like water, which has a strong dipole moment. Due to silica`s arrangement, it becomes strongly hydrophobic. Perhaps more to what Ron is suggesting, as I understood it, on a molecular level there are small divots or air pockets that increase the contact angle. I have no idea how that occurs, but I can`t see how those small spaces could be filled by a polymer of any sorts.

(I take this to mean that very few things applied to a coating will have an longevity since the solvent for a good deal of what we apply is water.)
 
The gloss shop who makes trifecta is also supposed to be coming out with a rinseless that leaves nothing behind. Although I`m not sure when it`s supposed to release.

I`d say for your purpose either this (depending when it comes out) or the new auto geek rinseless will be your best bet.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
Ronkh said:
Or in this case, where the op wants to test durability without adding anything. (or possibly clogging the coating)
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That right.

I wanna see if the PBL coating is legit or not. Many rinseless washes will add "something". that causes beading/sheeting.

I wanna see how this coating is on it`s own, or perhaps topped w/ the PBL coating booster at one point (but not as a Band Aid if the coating fails)

If I only get 6 months outta this stuff on it`s own, it`s a total waste IMHO. Yes it`s easy to apply, but so is Collinite.

I don`t see much of a point having to "top" or "boost" a coating. Because, I can just use wax and a spray wax after each wash and pretty much accomplish the same effect.

So, I`m trying to see if this stuff is technology for the sake of technology - or we really have something better here.

A coating that is no harder to apply than a durable wax, but no better.

-OR-

A coating that is no harder to apply than a durable wax, but lasts significantly longer.

So far,

1. PBL coating was ridiculously easy to apply. Basically, you could put it on as heavy as you want with an old sock and it would come out fine.

2. Initial beading is legit (I know, that doesn`t mean much).

3. I followed the installation instructions to the letter. I used IPA / Earaser as a wipedown prior to polishing with the PBL Surface Prep Polish. I polished every nanometer of the paint - areas unable to use a machine I used a new foam hand pad. Nothing touched the paint after the prep polish.

I used 2 brand new towels and 2 new LC coating applicator sponges. Believe me, there was no user error here. So if it ain`t no better than a long lasting wax or sealant - it won`t be my fault.


*** I guess I will use regular old ONR blue until something better comes along. I thought of using that and using Eraser as a drying aid to judge the true condition of the coating.
 
ONR works fine. You could just stick with a bucket wash and something like Reset until the McKee`s rinseless comes out.
 
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