After paint cleaner...

L

levander

New member
After paint cleaner, do you have to polish? I'm not doing the whole car in one afternoon.



Basically, I've gotta filthy car that I washed and not all the grime came off when I just went to a self-serve car wash place, rinsed it down, used the soaping brush, then rinsed it down again.



So, I wanna wash it like that again, then clay, then paint cleaner. But, I really don't want to take the time to polish too. I'm learning as I go. May get to polishing later.



But, if I paint clean and don't polish, am I leaving the paint more vulnerable than it was before?



From reading this forum, it sounds like I want to use Clay Magic which hopefully I can just find here at Target or at least Pep Boys.



Is there a good over the counter paint cleaner I should try to pick up?



The car is really dirty, so it's worth the time to find the better products.
 
One thing, NEVER EVER use the brush at the car wash on your paint, it's just gonna scratch the crap out of your paint. It's full of rocks, dirt, etc. Think of all the dirt you scrubbed off your car, now think of all the cars before you that did that, that's a lot of rocks in that brush.



You don't have to polish after using a paint cleaner, no. But it is recommended to get the best finish possible. As for over the counter, there's not what you would call higher end stuff all that often. There are paint cleaners available but kinda hard to work with. If you're claying the car though anyways, you're essentially doing the same thing as the paint cleaner though.
 
Not exactly.



Paint cleaner IS a polish (non abrasive).



wash

clay

paint cleaner

wax or sealant



OR, an ALL IN ONE that will clean polish and protect.
 
You're not going to find ClayMagic at Target or PepBoys, only AutoZone or Advanced (I can never keep them straight, we don't have too many around here, maybe they both have it or only one). PepBoys will have the Meg's white clay and I think the Mother's. Now that I think of it, Wal-Mart had some clay last time, I think.



Anyway, as has been said, you need to do a good wash with clean media, clay, and maybe the car will look "clean" to you then. If you use a paint cleaner, the car won't be any more "vulnerable" than it was before, but you need to put some protection on after, because it won't have any. If the car seems nice and "clean" after the clay, you can just use a cleaner-wax as tdekany noted, or you can use a paint cleaner and follow with a wax.
 
Duragloss Tpp 105 is an all in one (AIO) that you can buy OTC at Car Quest. It will clean and leave a durable shine until you can use a polish and Last Step Product (LSP).
 
Damn it's amazing how complicated cleaning a car is.



Not using the brush at the car wash place makes sense. But, now I'd have to buy my own chemical to wash the car and a brush. And probably a bucket too, to hold the car wash chemical and water. But, I think I've got old buckets around here somewhere.



SetecAstronomy says I can get away with claying and not protecting the paint. But, if I use a paint cleaner, then I definitely need to protect the paint? Because, the paint cleaner will strip any protectant the paint had on there to begin with. This car hasn't been waxed or paint sealed in a long time. So, I'm wondering if it still matters?



The thing is, I'm really just trying to get all the grime off the car right now. I can go back and wash, maybe re-clay, re-paint clean, then polish, and protect later? Getting all the grime off now will make doing that stuff later a lot easier.



But, if I want to go the easier route and still be somewhat thorough, the advice right now seems to be, 1.) wash, 2.) clay, 3.) an all in one.



What I was thinking before is that the car is so dirty on the outside, that using a dedicated paint cleaner might be warranted?



There's no Car Quest around here. So, I'm thinking I'm back in the mail order route. Especially now that I have to buy car wash and a brush too.
 
SurfCity Grime Destroyer will take off the grime since you mentioned it. Google it since I can't post links of it on here. Only use when your going to be applying some sealant since the above will strip off your protection.



wash

Clay Magic



Duragloss 101 contains both polish and sealant which is good since your applying by hand. That way your arms won't fall off when your done. Apply in back and forth motions.



Duragloss #101, Duragloss PC (Polish & Cleaner)



The Duragloss 105 contains cleaners and sealant but no polish(abrasives) eventhough its name contains the word "polish". Yes its confusing.
 
levander said:
SetecAstronomy says I can get away with claying and not protecting the paint. But, if I use a paint cleaner, then I definitely need to protect the paint? Because, the paint cleaner will strip any protectant the paint had on there to begin with. This car hasn't been waxed or paint sealed in a long time. So, I'm wondering if it still matters?



But, if I want to go the easier route and still be somewhat thorough, the advice right now seems to be, 1.) wash, 2.) clay, 3.) an all in one.



What I was thinking before is that the car is so dirty on the outside, that using a dedicated paint cleaner might be warranted?
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I didn't say that you could clay without applying any protection. I'd already made the assumption that you don't have any protection on there...what I was saying is that whichever "cleaning" step you take, whether it be clay, or paint cleaner, or both, that it's important to put some protection on after.



If you loosely break the "detailing" process into three steps, 1. Cleaning (wash, clay, paint cleaner and the like) 2. Polishing (abrasive removal of paint/defects) 3. Protection (wax, sealant), then you can do one or more of the things in step 1, and skip step 2, but you should always do step 3 to protect the work you've done.



As far as the complexity, you can lose your mind here. The comments about the brush at the self-serve car wash were about the brush; buy yourself a wash mitt or pad at Target and just use that, you don't need a bucket and separate car wash (just don't put the mitt/pad on the ground or it will wind up as dirty as the car wash brush).



Clay would help you but may not be necessary. If you've got that black gunk on the car that didn't come off in the wash, bring some home all purpose cleaner that's been diluted or some window cleaner and soak those difficult spots. Or buy some Deep Crystal Step 1 (what we call DC1) at Pep Boys and use that as a paint cleaner. Or some Meguiar's cleaner-wax in the red bottle, which will do both the cleaning and the waxing--just don't get it on your black trim or it will stain.



Again, the 3 basic steps I listed above, you can use a myriad of different products to acheive that, and make it as simple or as complicated as you'd like. It sounds like you'd like to make this as simple and as cheap as possible, but still get the "dirt" off of your car.



This is what I would recommend. Go to Pep Boys. They will have a fairly cheap bucket if you want to buy one of them to keep your stuff in. Find a wash pad or mitt. Be careful with any "scrubber" surfaces; that may help with your serious dirt, but be very gentle using that kind of surface. They should at least have a microfiber terry-covered sponge for about $4--not the best but it will work. If you'd like to try some all purpose cleaner or a small bottle of car wash to work into your hard-to-clean spots with the microfiber sponge, do that. If you want to splurge for clay, do that. Then buy the red-bottle Meg's Cleaner wax, should be about $8, I think. You'll need an applicator for the wax, and some sort of buffing towel to remove it. You may want to use the terry applicators because you want some bite to remove your dirt, and please don't buy the extra-cheap MF's at PepBoys for buffing--if Target is convenient, their orange towels will do well for you.



Then wash the car well, using the self-serve soap with the additional APC or wash you bought on the tough areas. Clay if you bought it. Then apply the cleaner wax, let haze, and buff. The car will likely be incredibly better than it was. Just be careful to work in the cleaner-wax well, use MUCH LESS then you think you should (that bottle should do your car 10-16 times), don't get excess in emblems and cracks, and keep it off of rubber and black trim (if you do get some on there, remove it quickly).
 
I've got to digest this post later when I have time, but wanted to clarify one thing.



Setec Astronomy said:
As far as the complexity, you can lose your mind here. The comments about the brush at the self-serve car wash were about the brush; buy yourself a wash mitt or pad at Target and just use that, you don't need a bucket and separate car wash (just don't put the mitt/pad on the ground or it will wind up as dirty as the car wash brush).
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The reason I think I need the bucket and the brush is because the foam you use to wash your car at the self-serve places comes out of the brush. It's like there's a hole in the middle of the brush the foam comes out of. So, the only way to apply the foam to your car is to use the brush. Hence, no self-serv car wash place brush, you need your own brush, bucket to hold your own wash chemical, and your own wash chemical.



Clay would help you but may not be necessary. If you've got that black gunk on the car that didn't come off in the wash, bring some home all purpose cleaner that's been diluted or some window cleaner and soak those difficult spots.
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The car is filthy, I'd be surprised if the clay isn't necessary. But, I'm going to the car wash place now to work on my carpets that I posted about in another thread. I'll grab some window cleaner or all purpose cleaner.



Can I use my Stoner's Invisible Glass on the paint? I don't know what all-purpose cleaner I have around here. Oh forget it, looks like I have more Autopia research to do before I even try to do it the easy way. I'll just work on the carpets and maybe spray the outside of the car down again when I'm there right now. Work on your suggestions later.



Comments on this thread definitely still appreciated.
 
Okay, I forgot something from my trip and had to come back.



First question, if I just rinse the car down with the pressurized hose at the car wash, how necessary is it to protect (wax or seal) the paint?



Then, it seems like the easiest way to just try to get all these spots off my car is to buy the Meguiar's Quick Detailer. But, I'd just like to spot clean and not do the whole car.



Basically, what I want to do is just rinse the car down, then spot-clean with the Meguiar's Quick Detailer. How good an idea is that?



I am interested in learning more about this, but I'm just starting small while trying to get my car clean. After it's clean, I can take more time and learn stuff slowly. Plus, I'm getting exposed to bigger concepts while I'm doing all this easy, small stuff.
 
Alright here's the shopping list for Walmart!

Megs clay kit-$30; includes 2 clay bars, Quick Detailer, Good Microfiber cloth, and cleaner wax.

Megs gold class car wash-$5-6

2 buckets-$3

Microfiber Wash mit-$5

Microfiber Detail cloths 10pk-$5

Now, get out there and do some hardcore paint correction!

Also, the search tab is stellar. DavidB also has a few in-depth articles on proper washing and care for novice detailers.

http://www.autopia.org/forum/guide-detailing/80238-introduction-detailing.html

http://www.autopia.org/forum/guide-detailing/

One must read to obtain knowledge, young grasshopper.
 
I just got back from the car wash place. I spent about 2 hours with carpets, windows, and Griot's interior cleaner wiping down a bunch of stuff. I'm getting there with the car, but there are things like, I was really happy because the driver's window is now almost clean. There was some sticky crud on the windows I got 90% off tonight.



rcrobbins, thanks. Every time someone spells it out like that, it makes things make a little more sense. But, where I'm at right now is fully described in post #11. I want to know:



1.) Can I rinse only at the self-serve car wash place without having to worry about re-protecting the paint afterwards? Also,



2.) Can I just spot clean using Meguiar's Quick Detail, or if you're gonna use it on some of the car you really need to go ahead and do the whole the car?



I'm going to read that Intro to Detailing now that you liked to rcrobbins. I already read some of the articles in that section. Quick glance, don't think I've read that one yet.
 
Of course you can just rinse without re-protecting the paint after. You can do anything you want without reprotecting after. You don't have any protection on there now, so what's the difference? Most of us simply like to protect our hard work of "detailing" by applying some protection after, but no police (unless there are Autopian police...hmm) will stop you on the way out of the self-serve for not applying wax.



And of course you can just spot clean with a QD. If you haven't removed dirt prior you may grind particulates into the surface and further degrade it, and the car may look uneven if you QD portions of it and not others, but nothing says you have to do the whole car, again, it doesn't violate any natural or written laws, as far as I know.
 
1) I couldn't find a test of how long megs cleaner wax lasts on average. I would say two-three weeks, maybe more. Research about visual cues of water sheeting and beading. Learning those characteristics alone will tell you if the surface has a protective layer after washing. The rinse should be fine at the wash, just do not let the shampoo dry on the car at all costs. If you're far away from one and do not have a water source to rinse, there's a product called "ONR", which safely eliminates the need to rinse if directions are carefully followed.

2) Yes, you can spot clean with Megs Quick Detail, from now on it's "QD" :) This creates tension on the surface, making it possible to remove smaller contaminates and at the same time makes the wax last longer between washes. Do not misuse this as a wash. It's made to remove noticeable contaminating factors, such as bird mayonnaise, tar and rubber from daily driving.

Youtube is an open source of information, but is provided by anyone. Please note that everything you view there is not necessarily correct or safe, much like the use of Wikipedia.
 
Setec Astronomy said:
Of course you can just rinse without re-protecting the paint after. You can do anything you want without reprotecting after.
Damn Setec, you went from highly instructive to down right, "whatever you want!!"



Most of us simply like to protect our hard work of "detailing" by applying some protection after ... [snipped further sarcasm :)]
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Yeah, but what I'm wondering is, all the washing and polishing things you listed earlier, do they remove any protectant you've previously, like how many ever months ago? The less protectant on your paint, the more vulnerable it is. So, you could spend all your time washing and polishing, then if you don't protect, 6 months from now you're 10 times worse off than you were before. Does it work like that? Or, does the protectant come off on its own, after time?



rcrobbins said:
Research about visual cues of water sheeting and beading. Learning those characteristics alone will tell you if the surface has a protective layer after washing.
Click to expand...



I just got back from the car wash place (didn't work much on exterior). And, believe it or not, there were beads of water on the paint after I was done... So, there is some protectant still on there? Now that I'm thinking, I did pay one of those $60 a detail place to detail it like 3 years ago. That was probably the last time the paint was protected. And, I remember they did a **** job. That's kind of why I'm looking into this stuff myself now.



Youtube is an open source of information, but is provided by anyone. Please note that everything you view there is not necessarily correct or safe, much like the use of Wikipedia.
Click to expand...



As is 98% of the internet. It used to be I could assuredly buy products just buy reading their user reviews. Not any more. Internet has too many people on it these days. We need to figure out how to get rid of a lot of them.



But anyway, I'm thinking my course of action is to buy the QD and whatever brush or applicator or whatever. Then, back at the car wash, pressure wash to rinse, and spot clean with QD.



Then, later I can do the full process, much like what rcrobbins itemized earlier in this thread. The reason I want to spot clean with QD now is how much gunk comes off the car determines if I need to buy the clay or not. And yes, I know, the clay would still help even if all visibly noticeable gunk comes off. But, I definitely need it if I can't get all the visible stuff off with QD.



Thanks guys.



Please correct me anywhere I'm screwing up. See my carpet thread for how I've screwed up my carpets. It's here: Click
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Now I remember you, from the "detailing kits for family holiday gifts" thread. I also remember that there was simply no satisfying you in that thread, so I'm going to cut my losses and stop now. Sorry.
 
levander - you make my blood boil. :p:p:p



Stop with that car wash place.



1 - if you have to, go back and pressure wash the hell out of the car.

2 - drive home.

3 - get a clean bucket and wash your car with car shampoo.

4 - clay the car while the car is still wet.

5 - dry the car

6 - polish your car

7 - protect the car.



PS: Waxes DO NOT last years. Polishing does remove protection. You have none on your car right now so the reason for polishing is to make the paint look good.



NOW READ ABOUT PROPER CAR CARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D:D:D
 
Bwahaha this thread is hilarious. You guys have a lot of patience.



What kind of retarded touchless car washes do you guys have there where you are at ? Because all of them I have ever seen

allow you to blast soap out of the pressure wand too.



Wash your car with soap

Then clay

Then any crap thats still on the paint, knock down with whatever QD you got

Then apply the wax



And the clay is for bonded tar, rail dust, etc. You arent using it to remove dust etc. Just so you understand.



got it?
 
Setec, thanks for remembering the car kit. It came out great. I completely cut out all the ******** and got a real small simple kit for everyone to maintain their car's interior appearance in between detailing. No one in my family gets their car detailed often enough. We're cheap that way! Thanks again for everyone who was so helpful in that thread.



tdekany, yeah, that's what I'm going to do, eventually.



The thing is there's so much filth on the car, and I spend so much time just getting the filth out, I want to get this heavy lifting done first.



Then later, I'll do the whole process from start to finish. And, it will be a lot easier to get done because I won't have to stop for ridiculous amounts of time in the middle of it removing ungodly amounts of filth. It will mostly be done.



It's funny that the car doesn't even look that bad to passer-by. But, the more I clean it, the more dirt I notice. And, grimy filthy dirt at that. And, I can concentrate more on thoroughness rather than scrubbing the hell out of the really bad spots.



But, you definitely added 2 things that I wanted to know. 1.) There's no protection on the paint now since waxes don't last that long, and 2.) polishing does remove protectant, which makes sense since polishing is abrasive.



But, washing steps (not polishing steps), those don't (typically) remove protectant?



I was just reading about ONR. It seems like that's really what I want to spot clean with instead of QD in my current situation. But, ONR doesn't come OTC...
 
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