Advice on filling swirls, will this process work?

What area are you in Mack maybe someone can give you a few samples or help you get started tackling the "swirls" that are troubling you

Hate to see you just buy product after product that isn`t doing what you want apparently you are gonna need more aggressive stuff and or take a different approach. It`s amazing what just a AIO on like a green pad or Orange pad can do on a machine.


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MattPersman said:
What area are you in Mack maybe someone can give you a few samples or help you get started tackling the "swirls" that are troubling you

Hate to see you just buy product after product that isn`t doing what you want apparently you are gonna need more aggressive stuff and or take a different approach. It`s amazing what just a AIO on like a green pad or Orange pad can do on a machine.


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Thanks Matt. Sounds like I`m not using aggressive enough products to remove the swirls. Honestly, I am a complete novice to this, so I am very worried about messing up the car. That`s why I was looking into filling the swirls rather than removing them.
 
MackCollier- Some sorta-random thoughts follow:

-It does indeed sound like the marring is too severe to merely conceal, no real surprise there as that looks pretty severe (but still safely fixable)
-Doing much of anything to lessen the marring is usually a *LOT* more involved than people think and almost always involves *MUCH* more aggressive measures than expected
-Doing it by hand would take countless hours and would require something like M101 for the initial step (that level of cut might be needed anyhow)
-I`d absolutely plan on two-stepping that if do plan to do much of anything in that direction
-[REPEAT comments about doing much of any correction until/unless you`re confident it won`t promptly get marred up again]
-I never expect any product to finish out ready-to-wax when used on a LC Orange Light Cut pad (and I`m used to hard clear)
-I utterly despise the black/dark gray LC pads and never use them for anything; opinions vary and that`s just mine
 
Accumulator said:
MackCollier- Some sorta-random thoughts follow:

-It does indeed sound like the marring is too severe to merely conceal, no real surprise there as that looks pretty severe (but still safely fixable)
-Doing much of anything to lessen the marring is usually a *LOT* more involved than people think and almost always involves *MUCH* more aggressive measures than expected
-Doing it by hand would take countless hours and would require something like M101 for the initial step (that level of cut might be needed anyhow)
-I`d absolutely plan on two-stepping that if do plan to do much of anything in that direction
-[REPEAT comments about doing much of any correction until/unless you`re confident it won`t promptly get marred up again]
-I never expect any product to finish out ready-to-wax when used on a LC Orange Light Cut pad (and I`m used to hard clear)
-I utterly despise the black/dark gray LC pads and never use them for anything; opinions vary and that`s just mine
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Appreciate the feedback. I think I need to leave the swirls alone and go back to what I was doing before.
 
Rohkh- Heh heh, not on your life ;) But that`s me and I`m like that about most everything. Though I guess it`s all relative, I can imagine some people here seeing a few of my vehicles and thinking they couldn`t live with `em. Well...maybe. Some of `em. maybe.
 
Ronkh said:
just given ya a hard time
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Heh heh, yeah...this whole Perfectionism thing is one area where I don`t mind being hypocritical :D

And the truth is, the one vehicle I appreciated the most was one I kept *FAR* from Autopian, just drove the wheels off it and didn`t obsess over marring at all (easy as it was white).
 
So a slight update to this thread...I thought that maybe I wasn`t working in the Black Hole and SSR1 enough by hand, so I decided to do the trunk as a test and if it looked like the BH was improving the swirls, I`d put it on the rest of the car. If not, I`d just go back to the Klasse Twins.

So I clayed the trunk, then applied in this order...SSR1, PB Polish with Carnauba, Black Hole, EX sealant with carnauba.

The claying got a lot of gunk out of the paint and the SSR1 and polish helped a bit as well. But I then applied the BH and saw no filling of the swirls. So I then topped it with the EX sealant and left it. This combination left the trunk with a VERY wet look. I was seriously impressed.

So I moved onto the roof, and did a different combination: I clayed, then did SSR1, then Klasse AIO, then EX sealant with carnauba. This made the paint a lot slicker and improved the looks, but the trunk still looked much wetter. I decided to top the roof with liquid natty`s red, and that did add some wetness, but the trunk still looks wetter.

Since the Black Hole didn`t fill the swirls on the trunk, I never thought to use it on the roof. But now I`m wondering if the BH is primarily responsible for the wet look on the trunk? I did go back and top the trunk with liquid natty`s red and it honestly didn`t change the look of the paint.

The only 2 products I used on the trunk that I didn`t on the roof were PB polish with carnauba and BH. I did use AIO on the roof and didn`t use it on the trunk. Would black hole cause that much extra of a `wet` look?
 
Poorboy said:
shiney is good too :)
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I think the less than stellar results I got were probably due more to me being a newbie and not understanding how to correctly apply the product.

A few days ago I decided to try again with the SSR1/PwC/BH/EX combo, and put it on my trunk. This time, I used far less product, and worked each product into the paint until it either started to shine, or started to dry out (SSR1).

As I told Ron, I still didn`t have much/any luck with BH filling the swirls, but the paint looked much wetter, I was thrilled with the results. I`m guessing it`s mostly due to my doing a better job of working the BH into the paint this time.

Apologies for the newbie question, but `buff to a shine` means work the product into the paint until it seems to disappear and you see a shine? I noticed that it says to do this with both PwC and BH, and I didn`t with either the first time I used them.

Also, it says `let it haze` for BH, does that mean work it in till it shines, then stop and let it sit on the paint until it seems hazy, and then remove?
 
MackCollier said:
I think the less than stellar results I got were probably due more to me being a newbie and not understanding how to correctly apply the product.
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there is always a learning curve for everyone at any level when using new products or using new procedures.

MackCollier said:
A few days ago I decided to try again with the SSR1/PwC/BH/EX combo, and put it on my trunk. This time, I used far less product, and worked each product into the paint until it either started to shine, or started to dry out (SSR1).
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This is correct .. at this point you wipe off and evaluate .. do I need more passes at this level or do I need to get more aggressive or do I move on to the next step. I fear you are rushing through the steps .. we used to have a member here named Boss429 .. he was a Master at polishing.
He would polish his truck for up to 17 hours to get the perfect finish before taking the next step. Without actually seeing your paint in person, we can only give you suggestions and you have to pick a panel and figure out how to get it perfect before moving to the next step or product.
We are more than willing to help you if you have the patience with us :)

MackCollier said:
As I told Ron, I still didn`t have much/any luck with BH filling the swirls, but the paint looked much wetter, I was thrilled with the results. I`m guessing it`s mostly due to my doing a better job of working the BH into the paint this time.
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yes working it into the finish is correct

MackCollier said:
Apologies for the newbie question, but `buff to a shine` means work the product into the paint until it seems to disappear and you see a shine? I noticed that it says to do this with both PwC and BH, and I didn`t with either the first time I used them.

Also, it says `let it haze` for BH, does that mean work it in till it shines, then stop and let it sit on the paint until it seems hazy, and then remove?
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yes, if you are using a machine, you work either product until you start seeing the shine pop out as you pass .. then stop .. let it haze over (flash) and then buff .. some people just looking for looks, will not wait for the haze and just buff ...
 
Black Hole can be huge contributor to the wet look, especially in the sense that it can save you time (and clear coat) achieving those results . This was (sadly, past tense) a car of mine that I did with SR2.5, some other polish that I forget, and then BH + Natty`s Blue. Take note that the car, at the time this picture was taken, was a bit dirty, and still looked "wet":

103-XL.jpg
 
Poorboy said:
there is always a learning curve for everyone at any level when using new products or using new procedures.
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This is honestly why I didn`t want to use a machine or go with products that were abrasive. I figured if I mess something up with a wax or sealant I can just remove and start over. But I really don`t like the idea of using a product/machine that can remove clearcoat until I learn how to properly use them.

I`m not too worried about removing any swirls at this point. I`d love it if the BH did some filling, but the wet look it gave the paint was awesome. I`m sure I`ll see similar results on the rest of the car, and I really like the idea of using products from the same company that work together. Also really like that a little amount seems to go a long way.
 
WaxAddict said:
Black Hole can be huge contributor to the wet look, especially in the sense that it can save you time (and clear coat) achieving those results . This was (sadly, past tense) a car of mine that I did with SR2.5, some other polish that I forget, and then BH + Natty`s Blue. Take note that the car, at the time this picture was taken, was a bit dirty, and still looked "wet":

103-XL.jpg
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Just gorgeous! Love the color as well.

BTW just thought of something, I`ve been doing some research on Black Hole this weekend, and it seems most people top it with a Natty`s wax as you did. Why didn`t you top it with a sealant and then go to a wax? Does the BH react differently to being topped with a wax versus a sealant?

I understand the sealant will be more durable, but just wondering if the wax being directly on top of BH might react differently than the sealant on top of the BH?
 
MackCollier said:
... Why didn`t you top it with a sealant and then go to a wax? ...
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Back when this picture was taken, I wouldn`t have had a sealant on hand, because I disliked them. However, two things come to mind: Natty`s lasts a long time, so it`s not like you`re using a beauty wax that lasts 2 weeks. It lasts months - maybe 70% as long as EX-P, and looks better in my opinion, so why NOT use NB? Secondly, as you layer, the top-most coat should be a "softer" product than the underlying coat, so it just "seems wrong" to use a sealant on top of just about anything to me. Maybe someone can chime in with some actual science.
 
WaxAddict said:
Back when this picture was taken, I wouldn`t have had a sealant on hand, because I disliked them. However, two things come to mind: Natty`s lasts a long time, so it`s not like you`re using a beauty wax that lasts 2 weeks. It lasts months - maybe 70% as long as EX-P, and looks better in my opinion, so why NOT use NB? Secondly, as you layer, the top-most coat should be a "softer" product than the underlying coat, so it just "seems wrong" to use a sealant on top of just about anything to me. Maybe someone can chime in with some actual science.
Click to expand...

It`s funny because I was thinking about this earlier, and the whole reason to go with a sealant was because I wanted to seal in the effects of the BH for longer. But then I realized that I would want to apply the wax regularly anyway, so why use the sealant? Seems like I could get the same result, by eliminating the sealant. Less product for the same end result is a good thing, which is what you were getting at, I believe. Plus the Liquid Natty`s Red is sooooo easy to put on and remove. Thanks for the feedback!
 
Mack, I was going to make a video for you using Black Hole. Then I remembered one already exists. Thanks to Mike Phillips at Autogeek.

 
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