Advice on Detailing Plans

[Heide264]

Hello,



Been snooping around the forums for a while, thought I'd finally register and get some opinions. I recently picked up a 2011 Subaru STi - a car finally worth keeping in good condition. I know the clear coat on them is iffy at best, but I thought I'd give it a go from the start. I really have no experience with car detailing. After reading around, I made a nice sized amazon purchase to get started. I wanted to find products that would allow me to tend to my car inside of a garage. It is nice to be able to wash my car off every week even during winter with the rock salt.

Down to the meat:

-Meguair's Quik Interior Detailer Cleaner (I really like it. Doesn't leave a dust magnet like armor all in my experience)

-Griot's Garage Wheel Cleaner (Just sprayed it on last night, cleaned the dust up real well)

-Mothers California Gold Clay Bar Paint Saving System (yet to use)

-Blackfire Wet Diamond All-Finish Paint Protection (yet to use)

-Poorboy's Spray & Wipe Waterless Wash (I park in the driveway normally... big oak tree and power lines overhead... needed something quick to take bird crap and bugs off)

-Optimum No Rinse Wash & Shine (Main car wash, really happy with it. I use this as well as a rinse bucket. Use my RO/DI filter for my fish tank to get some water that isn't so darn hard)

-Menzerna Final Polish (yet to use)



Applicators:

-Meguiar's EvenCoat Applicator

-Mothers Wheel Brush (meh, it is what it is. I needed one)

-Mothers Detail Brush Set

-Cables Unlimited Ultra Absorbent Microfiber Cleaning Cloths (not so sure about these. Shouldn't have cheaped out. Looking for some nice waffle weave ones now instead)





So far, I have been waiting for it to stop snowing to bust out the clay bar / polish / sealant. I'm a bit hesitant and nervous to use this stuff, but I can tell the coat could use it - bit bumpy. Getting the winter mess out of the clear coat will be a nice perk too. Just been washing it in the garage with the ONR when I get a chance once a week or so. Clean the wheels off as well. The brakes on that car are no joke - especially with the dust they put off during break in.



I plan on just giving it a good wash, going over it with the clay kit, using the included foam pad to apply the polish lightly, then putting on the sealant using one of the applicator pads from meguiars. Seem reasonable? Really could use some feedback if anybody has experience with any of the products. The directions with the polish are... well... small pictures in circles on the bottle =P.



Any feedback is appreciated!

 

[Accumulator]

Heide264- Welcome to Autopia!



I'd keep those Mother's brushes away from your paint



Use plenty of lube when claying, and remember that once clay picks up something abrasive it turns into sandpaper. So don't do long, sweeping motions (long scratches are awful compared to short little ones) and inspect/knead your clay frequently. I tear my claybars up into small pieces and clay with those instead of holding the whole bar in my hand.



You'll probably find that using the Menzerna Final Polish by hand is quite a chore and that it doesn't do all that much to correct any marring your paint might have. Be sure to work it long enough for the (rather mild) abrasives to break down. If (more like "when") your polish applicator starts to get loaded up with old polish, either wash (Dawn works OK), rinse, and dry it or get out a new applicator. Don't let the polish dry out completely before you buff it off, you want it just a little "still wet".



Perhaps needless to say, but you'll use a different applicator for the BlackFire than you used for the polish.

 

[Heide264]

Thanks for the feedback.



I wanted a Polish just to use once a year or so to just renew my paint a bit. The clear coat is really thin on these cars, so i just wanted something mild and that i could use by hand for experience. Thanks for the tip on cleaning the pad. I would have stumbled on that issue half way through, haha.



I have a pack of applicators I bought listed above that I was planning on using with the black fire.



Considering my car was brand new a couple months ago, would it be a good idea to just clay and use the sealant? I don't know have any experience, so smaller steps would help. Also, once I apply the black fire, I can layer it or apply a natural wax on top if I so desire?



Posted from my phone ... Excuse the grammar.

 

[Afflicted]

Oddly enough, I was just about to make my first post regarding my car... a 2011 STi in plasma blue, lol. Congrats on the STi... what color do you have? I'm taking the plunge into a da machine so I'm going to start another post and not thread jack. LMK if you have any car-specific questions if you go that route.

 

[Accumulator]

I wanted a Polish just to use once a year or so to just renew my paint a bit. The clear coat is really thin on these cars, so i just wanted something mild and that i could use by hand for experience...

OK, gotcha. I did some sections of my WRX by hand, and the clear was pretty easy to work. But that was a while ago too and they might be different now. Still thin though I bet.

Considering my car was brand new a couple months ago, would it be a good idea to just clay and use the sealant? I don't know have any experience, so smaller steps would help.

If it's a light color I'd either clay it or use a decontamination system (which are *VERY* easy to use) to preclude the chance of "rust-blooms" from ferrous contamination like rail dust. Even more important on thin-paint vehicles IMO.



Some would say to clay it period, but I can go both ways as sometimes people instill marring when they clay.

Also, once I apply the black fire, I can layer it or apply a natural wax on top if I so desire?

You could top it (I wouldn't so you can add more BF later), but I doubt you'll need to as BF looks mighty "wax-like" anyhow.

 

[cptzippy]

If the finish looks ok to you, you can skip the polish/correction stage. I did last year because of time after buying my car just before it got cold.



As far as layering, yes, you should be able to put a layer of wax over top of it (ie carnuba).

 

[2005GTPinMD]

Congratulations on your purchase and welcome. You bought a great assortment there. I love BFWD and the Quik detailer. You got a great assortment there.

 

[Heide264]

Thanks again for the feedback.



I will check out the decontamination stuff. Never heard of it.



Car is their world rally blue and a hatch. Love it. Know the paint is bad though lol. Figure i will try my best though.



I will at least clay it before the bf. I want to make sure that rock salt and junk is out. I live by Pittsburgh.



Thanks again.



Posted from my phone ... Excuse the grammar.

 

[Accumulator]

Heide64- Until I read about your location, I was gonne lean towards not worrying about claying/decontaminating the car (based on the color). But now I think that yeah, you might oughta decon it.



Maybe I'm too paranoid about your claying it, but I'd hate for you to instill marring that you won't get out with that Menzerna (via hand).

 

[Heide264]

Hrmm. Well you have a lot more experience than I do. I also don't mind picking up more stuff if needed later on ... be it a machine or different Polish or what. Just trying to take it in small steps ... especially with the thin clear coat.



I really feel more comfortable running the clay over it before it gets more junk in it. Unless you feel strongly that there is a better, safer way for now.



Posted from my phone ... Excuse the grammar.

 

[cptzippy]

The Mother's clay should be fine if you don't apply pressure and use plenty of lube. If you're still nervous you can try Pinnacle Poly or Sonus which are both generally reported to be much gentler.

 

[Heide264]

Did another ONR wash last night. It's awesome to be able to wipe my car off in the garage in the evening. I do need to get some more lights going in there though to make life a bit easier. Still no signs of any marring (maring?).



One oddball thing I noticed and brought up with another STi owner, is the paint looks odd. It feels smooth to my touch, but when you look at it, it looks 'pebbly'. It almost looks as if somebody made the car out of clay, and then used the end of a rounded pencil eraser to 'pat down' the paint. There are many small circles about 1/16" in diameter... Almost look like ripples. I can not personally feel them, however. Any thoughts on it?



I am still planning on claying the car, making sure to keep very light pressure on the clay and keep it well lubed. Which one would you suggest: Concentrated ONR or the meguiar's detail spray that came with the clay? I am leaning towards the spray that came with it. After claying, I think I will go on to do a polish with the Menzerna and then apply the BlackFire. Do I need to do any prep after the Menzerna?



What do you recommend using to wash the car with ONR? I have just been using microfiber cloths with no real complaints, other than they do get dirty fairly quickly - I go through two a wash. I think I need to pick up some towel cleaner at this point, but dish soap did a fairly good job as well.

 

[cptzippy]

IMHO either will work as a clay lube. I think the ONR will end up being less expensive in the long run but you already have the Meg's so I'd use it up.



There are lots of things that will work to wash with ONR. I use a microfiber pad I got from Griot's a while back but many people use Home Depot grout sponges to good effect.



Not sure what to make of your description of your paint; I'll let the pro's comment on that.

 

[Heide264]

IMHO either will work as a clay lube. I think the ONR will end up being less expensive in the long run but you already have the Meg's so I'd use it up.



There are lots of things that will work to wash with ONR. I use a microfiber pad I got from Griot's a while back but many people use Home Depot grout sponges to good effect.



Not sure what to make of your description of your paint; I'll let the pro's comment on that.

Thanks.



I don't have any tire care products. Anything you would suggest? I don't want my tires looking like a mirror (*cough Armor All *cough), but I have had trouble finding good articles on any maintenence I should be doing on them. I guess worst case scenario... they probably won't last that long anyhow .



Will try to get a picture of the paint. It's at the level where the cell phone pictures are obsolute so I will do what I can.



Appreciate the feedback.

 

[SilverCivic]

That "pebble" look you see in your paint is called orange peel. When the paint is sprayed on the car it does not lay perfectly flat and gives the look that you see.

 

[Accumulator]

//. I do need to get some more lights going in there though to make life a bit easier. Still no signs of any marring (maring?).

Mar. Marring. Marred.



With more/better lights, you might find that it's a bit marred up after all. But no need to look for trouble at this point. DO get good lighting before you do anything like the polishing/waxing though, lest you have some issue that you don't notice until later, like...when it's in the sun or under lights at night.

One oddball thing I noticed and brought up with another STi owner, is the paint looks odd. It feels smooth to my touch, but when you look at it, it looks 'pebbly'. It almost looks as if somebody made the car out of clay, and then used the end of a rounded pencil eraser to 'pat down' the paint. There are many small circles about 1/16" in diameter... Almost look like ripples. I can not personally feel them, however. Any thoughts on it?

My general, overall thought is "don't sweat it". Unless it's so unusual and so unacceptable that you think Subaru will give you a new car I don't see any point in giving it much thought. Eh, every single one of my vehicles has crappy factory paint, even the pricey Audis (so much for their fancy robotic paint systems).



Is the weird texture all over? Lots of cars have it on the lower areas...can't remember how mine was



Eh, all this talk about it having crappy paint...I dunno...I guess mine wasn't anything awful or I'd remember it. Remember that the Impreza (WRX/etc. or not) is an inexpensive vehicle. No matter how much high-performance stuff they bolt onto it, the starting point is what it is. The paint on my WRX sure wasn't any thinner than that on my Mazda MPV :nixweiss

I am still planning on claying the car, making sure to keep very light pressure on the clay and keep it well lubed. Which one would you suggest: Concentrated ONR or the meguiar's detail spray that came with the clay? I am leaning towards the spray that came with it.

I always seem to do best with dedicated clay lubes, but if you run out you could switch to the ONR.

I really feel more comfortable running the clay over it before it gets more junk in it. Unless you feel strongly that there is a better, safer way for now.

OK, plenty of people clay without any problems at all.

FWIW, the decontamination systems are basically just washing the car three times with stuff that's 1) strongly alkaline, 2) strongly acidic, and finally 3) ph-neutral. And that "strongly" is all relative; IMO they're not all that strong at all.

After claying, I think I will go on to do a polish with the Menzerna and then apply the BlackFire. Do I need to do any prep after the Menzerna?

Be sure to have very good lighting for this part of it. I don't know if you need to strip the Menzerna's oils/etc. before applying the BF or not, I always used BF over the BF prep product.

What do you recommend using to wash the car with ONR? I have just been using microfiber cloths with no real complaints, other than they do get dirty fairly quickly - I go through two a wash. I think I need to pick up some towel cleaner at this point, but dish soap did a fairly good job as well.

I'd go through a *LOT* more towels than that ONRing a whole car. But that's just me and once something's dirty I don't want it touching my paint.



IMO washing them with dish soap/whatever is 100% OK. I use Dawn and it's basically replacing the fancy MF-detergents I used previously (but note that those did work a lot better than regular laundry detergent for me).

 

[Heide264]

Mar. Marring. Marred.



With more/better lights, you might find that it's a bit marred up after all. But no need to look for trouble at this point. DO get good lighting before you do anything like the polishing/waxing though, lest you have some issue that you don't notice until later, like...when it's in the sun or under lights at night.

I have two double 4' or so flourescent ballasts overhanging the other side of the garage that just need light replacements... Should do the trick.

My general, overall thought is "don't sweat it". Unless it's so unusual and so unacceptable that you think Subaru will give you a new car I don't see any point in giving it much thought. Eh, every single one of my vehicles has crappy factory paint, even the pricey Audis (so much for their fancy robotic paint systems).



Is the weird texture all over? Lots of cars have it on the lower areas...can't remember how mine was

It seemed to be consistent all over the car. It looks fine unless really close. Even then it doesn't look 'bad'. I just wanted to check if there is anything that I should do about it. Trust me, if there is nothing actually at work hurting the pain, then I have no problem leaving that there.

Eh, all this talk about it having crappy paint...I dunno...I guess mine wasn't anything awful or I'd remember it. Remember that the Impreza (WRX/etc. or not) is an inexpensive vehicle. No matter how much high-performance stuff they bolt onto it, the starting point is what it is. The paint on my WRX sure wasn't any thinner than that on my Mazda MPV :nixweiss

Yup, one of the larger complaints from people about them come 5 years into owning them I've found. Also the main reason I'd like to keep up with it as much as possible. I realize keeping it pristine over time may be fighting an uphill battle Vs. a paint job, but it is good practice nonetheless. It also feels good to step into a car thinking, "Wow, it's clean" as opposed to the normal, "Ugh, I really should wash this thing".

I always seem to do best with dedicated clay lubes, but if you run out you could switch to the ONR.

OK, plenty of people clay without any problems at all.

Cool. Will run it over before polishing.

FWIW, the decontamination systems are basically just washing the car three times with stuff that's 1) strongly alkaline, 2) strongly acidic, and finally 3) ph-neutral. And that "strongly" is all relative; IMO they're not all that strong at all.

I may look into these eventually, but for now just going to stick with polish. Good idea with the acid/base wash though. Acid/base chemistry is a very powerful tool that most people are either intimidated by or unfamiliar with. Always seems to come up in hobbies.

Be sure to have very good lighting for this part of it. I don't know if you need to strip the Menzerna's oils/etc. before applying the BF or not, I always used BF over the BF prep product.

I didn't get a prep product with it =/. Maybe wiping it down with mineral spirits first would be a good idea? I didn't really get any instructions other than what is on the bottle... which I haven't fully read off hand.

I'd go through a *LOT* more towels than that ONRing a whole car. But that's just me and once something's dirty I don't want it touching my paint.



IMO washing them with dish soap/whatever is 100% OK. I use Dawn and it's basically replacing the fancy MF-detergents I used previously (but note that those did work a lot better than regular laundry detergent for me).

I was short on towels until a recent trip to target. Will probably start using more of them. Can't hurt, and isn't hard to wash more towels afterwards.





Thanks again for the feedback. Think I got all my questions out of the way for now. I will try to snag a camera from my sister that is half decent and post some pictures to get some thoughts on the process.

 

[Accumulator]

I have two double 4' or so flourescent ballasts overhanging the other side of the garage that just need light replacements... Should do the trick...

FWIW, I find fluorescents basically worthless for spotting marring. Under fluorescent light everything looks perfect compared to how it looks under truly demanding lighting. I have literally dozens of 8' tubes and I have to turn them all off to see the kind of flaws that drive me nuts. Anything you can see under fluorescents would have to be mighty scary indeed!

It seemed to be consistent all over the car. It looks fine unless really close. Even then it doesn't look 'bad'. I just wanted to check if there is anything that I should do about it. Trust me, if there is nothing actually at work hurting the pain, then I have no problem leaving that there.

I'd be a little surprised if anything were actually, *actively* hurthing the paint, but a decontamination oughta stop anything like that if it is going on.

Yup, one of the larger complaints from people about them come 5 years into owning them I've found. Also the main reason I'd like to keep up with it as much as possible. I realize keeping it pristine over time may be fighting an uphill battle Vs. a paint job, but it is good practice nonetheless. It also feels good to step into a car thinking, "Wow, it's clean" as opposed to the normal, "Ugh, I really should wash this thing".

I was able to keep my WRX so nice that when I sold it I didn't even have to do anything except a wash for the buyer to be all "wow, this thing is perfect!". It wasn't all *that* bad a paint to maintain, but using many layers of KSG probably helped in that regard (same as it did for my MPV...FWIW, lots of KSG is my usual prescription for thin clear drivers).

I didn't get a prep product with it =/. Maybe wiping it down with mineral spirits first would be a good idea? I didn't really get any instructions other than what is on the bottle... which I haven't fully read off hand.

I'm not a big fan of wiping down with Mineral Spririts, even though people do it all the time. I'd just ask about it here (maybe in a new thread) and see if there's a problem. Or do a Dawn wash. Or use IPA, or better yet, TOL's PrepWash. The Dawn would be a simply solution though...

I was short on towels until a recent trip to target. Will probably start using more of them. Can't hurt, and isn't hard to wash more towels afterwards.

And I'd be buying *VERY* high quality MFs.

 

[Heide264]

FWIW, I find fluorescents basically worthless for spotting marring. Under fluorescent light everything looks perfect compared to how it looks under truly demanding lighting. I have literally dozens of 8' tubes and I have to turn them all off to see the kind of flaws that drive me nuts. Anything you can see under fluorescents would have to be mighty scary indeed!

I have found it's better than incadescent at least. Is there any lighting you would suggest in a reasonable price range? I really do like to work in a contained garage versus outside. I hate that feeling of seeing a bird crap on your car mid wash. I have a couple flood lights I can clip up as well.

I'd be a little surprised if anything were actually, *actively* hurthing the paint, but a decontamination oughta stop anything like that if it is going on.

I think I'll hold off until next winter to give that one a go. Small steps.

I was able to keep my WRX so nice that when I sold it I didn't even have to do anything except a wash for the buyer to be all "wow, this thing is perfect!". It wasn't all *that* bad a paint to maintain, but using many layers of KSG probably helped in that regard (same as it did for my MPV...FWIW, lots of KSG is my usual prescription for thin clear drivers).

That makes me feel a lot better. I do not know what KSG is. It is a daily driver, and it is parked outside 75% of the time - either under a huuuuge oak tree or under telephone lines going into the house. I am guessing Klasse something or other. Will layering the BlackFire accomplish the same?

I'm not a big fan of wiping down with Mineral Spririts, even though people do it all the time. I'd just ask about it here (maybe in a new thread) and see if there's a problem. Or do a Dawn wash. Or use IPA, or better yet, TOL's PrepWash. The Dawn would be a simply solution though...

Will make a new thread after reading the bottles to make sure it doesn't say on there.

And I'd be buying *VERY* high quality MFs.

I thought the 'Vroom' ones from Target were generally surprisingly good quality. They feel very nice actually. My first dry with the one did shed a tiny bit, but nothing bad. I plan on picking up a bunch of them in different colors to keep my towels straight.

 

[Accumulator]

I have found it's better than incadescent at least. Is there any lighting you would suggest in a reasonable price range? I really do like to work in a contained garage versus outside. I hate that feeling of seeing a bird crap on your car mid wash. I have a couple flood lights I can clip up as well...

Exact opposite findings here; I use incandescent for inspections, better for me than even my halogens.



You oughta check out the numerous threads on lighting...sorry to sound all "go search" but it's something we've gone into in detail and I only have a moment here at present.

I do not know what KSG is. It is a daily driver, and it is parked outside 75% of the time - either under a huuuuge oak tree or under telephone lines going into the house. I am guessing Klasse something or other. Will layering the BlackFire accomplish the same?

Klasse Sealant Glaze is a good sealant. Layering BF never did all that much for me compared with KSG but it's what you have so give it a try.