$75-100 an hr????

After listening to feedback two years ago at MTE, I changed my pricing and tried to get away from "packages" unless the undertone was per hour. I have been able to make more per hour while doing what customers want--listening to them first and detailing second.



Someone made a comment about being OCD. Perhaps, but that won't produce a profit...maybe your customer is really happy so you feel good inside, but are you working for three hours on a wash and wax for a total of about $80? Not sure what you charge, but months from now you may not have the money to buy more wax.



I think there are people here that detail for a hobby- side business. Grouse and others that do this full time, can't charge 20 per hour and pay the bills. This is why I pay my plumber $50 to just show up to my home! This is why my contractor walks away with 50k profit after a remodel. They have to pay bills, send their kids to college, and put money away for retirement.



When I first began, I charged what I considered a nice "side gig" salary. $40 per wash and wax and 10 per wash! I remember seeing the cash in a drawer in my and thinking that it was great. However, whenever I wanted to put an ad in the paper, buy a new piece of equipment, or try new products, that money quickly disappeared.



After networking with other profitable detailers who own and run a real business, I learned a few things. My time is worth more than what I was charging. My customer service, training, equipment, etc. are worth top dollar. I'm not detailing because I like cars, or like to make them shiny, or do people a favor. If I'm not with my kids or wife, then my time is worth the money I charge. I want to make money, not just enough money to pay for products and eat out once in a while.



I have been working alone mostly this year. Each job I plan to make $50 or more per hour before tips..should that occur.



I don't tell people I charge that per hour, rather, I explain what I'm going to do and about how long it should take and write them an estimate. I do not get every job, but I don't lower my estimate if I feel the customer walking. My time is worth what I charge as is what and how I do my job.



I never worry about the countless detailers in my town breaking the law and charging $20 per wash while their waste water runs all over the parking lot. I focus on ME!



With one employee, I will make $80 per hour and paying someone 12 per hour, I will make more. Just have to build slowly until weekly clients are set. With the new washing products out there that I am using, we can do an exterior wash in about 10 min. or less and a full wash in 20 min. at $30 or more per wash.



With this economy, it is hard. However, I am lucky to have the resources available that won't put me out of business, but I suspect many of my competitors are barely hanging on and almost gone--in the next few months, there will be less detailers in my town.



Plan your marketing and time it well.



Guys like Andrew Evans in my town will still be here..unless he decides to move. :) He's a professional. Customers trust and spend money where they trust. It's not always price for many customers. Not the smart ones anyway.



I won't say my total plan for this summer..only a few select networking detailers are privy to that, but if it DOES work, I'll be doing over 100 per hour and almost not working. I'll be an owner, not a technician.



All in good taste, I hope.



Robert Regan
 
The premise of this thread may be flawed.



First, "...a guy named Mel Craig. Apparently he is a big trainer for Meg's. "



I've never heard of the guy. I'll guess he's with the Miami-based Meg's Distributor.



I'm all for being efficient, but let's do the simple math:



45 hours per week (I do >60).

$100 per hour equals $4500 per week (I'd get $6000)

Work 48 weeks per year/equals $216,000 ($288,000)



Let's be real, no single man operation can generate those numbers, fixed or mobile.

With 4 workers, yes it can be done, but not single.



Jim
 
reparebrise said:
Brad



Yes we accomplish this in less than an hour, and we do so day in and say out. Unlike you we are not mobile so we have the luxury of having everything at hand and ready to work for every car. The cars we are doing range from cream puffs to lease returns, that did not maintain the car.



I took a look at your site and in particular your detailing packages(please check the spelling in the gold packages). The prices/times you quote would be for me suicidal, the prices you charge would barely cover my employees wages. If you are able to keep your business afloat for $50 per hour, than thats great for you, but in my case that is not possible.



In our pricuing structure we include such items as future growth, the goal is not just to cover our costs, but also to create profit in order to be able to continue serving our customers in the future.
Click to expand...



Yvan- Thanks for viewing my site and pointing out the spelling error. It has already been fixed. I tried to view yours, but it would not load. Yes, I have less overhead than you, and yes I am able to operate on around $50 an hour and make a profit. In fact, I have been profitable since the first year operating full time. The times I have quoted for those packages, is the time it takes to do the job CORRECTLY. I provide great value to my customers, in the hopes of forming a long term relationship. I would love to charge $100 an hour, like you, but obviously the packages prices would be unattainable, for nearly everyone. In my previous posts I was not calling you a liar. I simply said that it was unlikely that one person could do all those steps in an hour or less, without compromising something. If in fact your techs do, that is amazing. I would be left to wonder, however, if the quality has been effected. When you are asked how you pull off these awesome efficiencies, you responses are very general and usually have something to do with it being a franchise secret. As I said, before, I would like to see your process in person to see where I could become more efficient.
 
Brad, we accomplish this by analysing the complete process, from the placement of the tools, the lighting, the products we use, the pads we use, the temperature in the shop, even down to the music in the shop (lets just say the Carpenters do not make for speedy work....) Many detailer get bogged down as being technicians, step aside, and become a manager for a while, things will improve for sure.



Quality is far from suffering, I would say that we do a muchbetter job in 1 hour than when it took us 2 hours to do the same job. The goal in reducing time was to maintain or improve quality, while not having to increase our prices. Our customers in general do not know our hourly rate, all they know is that there car is delivered as prommised, and that the price is fair. If a customer figures out that we have done the job in an hour, while the competition down the stree take 2, they sometimes do mention that we make a good hourly wage, we reply that they have paid for a service, we delivered this service as expected for an agreed upon price, and that we have invested in developing these processes in order to give them superior quality, while maintaining profitability. When they see our shops they realize that we have invested much more than your average detail shop in tools and infrastructure. The end result is that we charge a fair rate, but we are able to do the job faster. When you go to the mechanic they are often paid the book rate, meaning that replacing part X is supposed to take 2 hours, if that mechanic has aquired skills and tools to be able to do it in 1 hour he still gets paid for 2, it's the same with us.



Yes I am vague about this because I have invested much time, thought, and money in developing this, and this knowledge is for sale, not for free. One free tip for thyose in a fixed shop situation get a scissor lift for every bay, you will see a boost in productivity immediatly, and for mobile opperators get a Racatac, again a must have tool for good productivity.



Our web sites are going througha complete make over, so at times they may be unavailable Répare-brise Spécialiste en réparation de pare-brise et retouche de peinture is the one to see for now
 
toyotaguy said:
not going to happen alone, you will get burned out rather quickly.
Click to expand...



I know, I was being a wise guy as usual.



I like guys who think they make $300 per hour, but only work 2 hours per day, 1 day per week!



Lets divide that $600 by the standard 40 hour work week and you have your rate of $15 per hour. Or worse, what if you only did that for the entire month! Not so interesting anymore is it?



Be real gents, its all in the final take, not the "simulated houlry ego rate". If you cant sustain it, its fiction.



I once did a car for $1500 in 8 hours. Does that mean I make $187.50 per hour detailing? No! It means that DAY I made $187.50 per hour detailing.



Average it out over a 250 day work year and see what your rate is....
 
^^^Good point jdoria - This is why I choose not to charge by the hour on jobs. You could definately short change yourself out of some extra profit(kinda like how many body men turn 200 hours/week). OTOH, unless you're doing a service that requires 100% perfect paint correction and should be charged out per hour, being an experienced Pro means you should have some kind of knowledge of what and how long the job should take.
 
I think it needs to be said that there is a vast difference between a one man operation charging $75/hr vs. a shop set-up to generate $75/hr. They are two entirely different means to an end. You almost cannot directly compare the way both go about their business, even though both are detailing businesses. The business models, tools, set-ups, chemicals will be very different.
 
MichaelM said:
I think it needs to be said that there is a vast difference between a one man operation charging $75/hr vs. a shop set-up to generate $75/hr. They are two entirely different means to an end. You almost cannot directly compare the way both go about their business, even though both are detailing businesses. The business models, tools, set-ups, chemicals will be very different.
Click to expand...



And we have a winner!
 
MichaelM said:
I think it needs to be said that there is a vast difference between a one man operation charging $75/hr vs. a shop set-up to generate $75/hr. They are two entirely different means to an end. You almost cannot directly compare the way both go about their business, even though both are detailing businesses. The business models, tools, set-ups, chemicals will be very different.
Click to expand...



I agree Mike. Funny how the business models of body shops and detail shops are similar, (but different), but a detail shop has less overhead (labor/building/equipment/tools) and charges more per hour? Doesn't make sense to me? Wonder why?
 
David- When you had your business in MI, did you have a shop rate? Did you work off packages? How many tech's did you have?



Just curious because I know you've "been there, done that" when it comes to running a fixed location detail shop.
 
Nope, no hourly rate was followed. I did mostly wholesale but had a significant amount of retail clients as well. I had a brocure that got distributed, but that was more or less used as a guide. Most of the time customers were upsold and/or had work tailored to their specific needs. I had 6-8 techs and usually 2 of them were prepping cars and/or doing final inspections; reducing the amount of work(touch time) the detailers needed to spend of each vehicle. We did 25-30 vehicles per day, 6 days a week and my detailers (sub-contractors) were paid anywhere from 30-40% of the detail charged to the client. For my application (high volume) I could have never followed any kind of structured hourly rate.
 
Wow, 25-30 cars a day! That is incredible. I like your idea about having techs for prepping and final inspection and tech's for the actual detail work. I'll have to remember that.



Doing that many cars each day, were you able to keep quality & service at a high level for the retail cars? I assume you had pretty good procedures in place with that much work and that many people working for you.
 
Our motto written on the wall was "Quality is King". In the 10+ years owning/operating the business, we never lost 1 dealer account and never solicited one either. Word of mouth traveled throughout dealers/wholesalers that we consistently did quality work in a timely manner and they always approached us to do their vehicles. It grew from there and it later allowed me to sell my shop for a really nice amount based on the reputation I created (w/o any formal contract in place from my clientel either).
 
I've been watching this thread with interest. From a detailing customer's perspective, I would be wary if I paid for a wash/clay/light polish/wax and my car came out in an hour, unless I found out a team was working on it. I don't mind expedient work habits, but I do mind rushing, especially when it comes to my $40k car.



Let's not make this more complicated than it is. Unless the hand of God is involved in each one of your 1-hour details, something is being comprimised. Period.
 
15951,



Not that I can work THAT fast! However, if looking at it honestly through the eyes of about 98% of all customers, a wash/clay/polish-sealer job that takes 2 guys 2 hrs. or less for $150 would be great for most people if you explain what they are getting. It's almost impossible to take away the "detailer" in the way we look at our work so when you say, "Looking at it from the customer's point of view," I wonder if it is really a dedicated detailer's point of view?? I could be wrong, but want to play the Devil's advocate here.



I used to do a 45 min. wax with 3 employees on weekly customers. The customers raved about the appearance of the cars and never questioned why it took 45 min. to complete- hand waxed by the way. I had a chart that covered each person's job on every car and it became very efficient to where we could not talk and get done very quickly without skipping steps.



These customers were thrilled to pay what they did for the service at their homes and I bet that 95% of the detail customers out there would "see" their car and gladly pay $100 for a one hr. detail because some of you guys can make that 1 hr. job look better than many "detailers" who would spend 3 hrs. screwing up the paint.



There is a value for each customer and from listening to mine lately, it is not speed, but what they get for that 1-2 hrs. of work. They are fine with what is produced. They don't want a car in a show, they want it to shine and be clean. I could cheat them out of wax and they would think it was waxed-I won't do that, but it could be done.



When discussing clay, how many customers already know what you are talking about? And there lies the 95 percentile of all customers!!



Hope that makes some sense..



Robert Regan
 
WCD said:
15951,



Not that I can work THAT fast! However, if looking at it honestly through the eyes of about 98% of all customers, a wash/clay/polish-sealer job that takes 2 guys 2 hrs. or less for $150 would be great for most people if you explain what they are getting. It's almost impossible to take away the "detailer" in the way we look at our work so when you say, "Looking at it from the customer's point of view," I wonder if it is really a dedicated detailer's point of view?? I could be wrong, but want to play the Devil's advocate here.



I used to do a 45 min. wax with 3 employees on weekly customers. The customers raved about the appearance of the cars and never questioned why it took 45 min. to complete- hand waxed by the way. I had a chart that covered each person's job on every car and it became very efficient to where we could not talk and get done very quickly without skipping steps.



These customers were thrilled to pay what they did for the service at their homes and I bet that 95% of the detail customers out there would "see" their car and gladly pay $100 for a one hr. detail because some you guys can make that 1 hr. job look better than many "detailers" who would spend 3 hrs. screwing up the paint.



There is a value for each customer and from listening to mine lately, it is not speed, but what they get for that 1-2 hrs. of work. They are fine with what is produced. They don't want a car in a show, they want it to shine and be clean. I could cheat them out of wax and they would think it was waxed-I won't do that, but it could be done.



When discussing clay, how many customers already know what you are talking about? And there lies the 95 percentile of all customers!!



Hope that makes some sense..



Robert Regan
Click to expand...

You make some valid points. Thank you for keeping the post alive!
 
A shop designed to make $75 per hour is a waste of time.



Unless its $75 per hour PROFIT after business and personal expenses and owners salary.



That is only $750 per 10 hour day! Think of paying rent, payroll, taxes, supplies, and insurance on that!



Oops, you cant....
 
jdoria said:
I know, I was being a wise guy as usual.



I like guys who think they make $300 per hour, but only work 2 hours per day, 1 day per week!



Lets divide that $600 by the standard 40 hour work week and you have your rate of $15 per hour. Or worse, what if you only did that for the entire month! Not so interesting anymore is it?



Be real gents, its all in the final take, not the "simulated houlry ego rate". If you cant sustain it, its fiction.



I once did a car for $1500 in 8 hours. Does that mean I make $187.50 per hour detailing? No! It means that DAY I made $187.50 per hour detailing.



Average it out over a 250 day work year and see what your rate is....
Click to expand...



That's exactly how I work out my take home. For regular customers I charge $60/hr, but that includes travel/set up etc... At the end of the year my goal is to take home $350 a day on average, regardless of how little or much I work on any given day.
 
jdoria said:
A shop designed to make $75 per hour is a waste of time.



Unless its $75 per hour PROFIT after business and personal expenses and owners salary.



That is only $750 per 10 hour day! Think of paying rent, payroll, taxes, supplies, and insurance on that!



Oops, you cant....
Click to expand...





yeah you can...22500 per month is plenty for a shop with a rent of about 4K, 3 employees, and supplies, and all the rest. If you are trying to make 200K a year as the owner, then no. But if you are more than happy with say 100K a year (which most people are), then its fine
 
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