Why are DA's so popular?

M

MidwayRec

New member
When I learned to buff (as they used to call it I guess), everything was wool, high speed, and aggressive products. It was easy then to damage a finish with burns and swirls if you weren't careful.

Today, with the slower rotary speeds, the foam pads, and the versatile compounds and polishes, you'd have to be pretty care less to really damage a vehicle with a rotary.

With that being said, why use a DA? Seems like a rotary is much more effective at getting the jobs done and much faster as well.

I'm not knocking the DA polishers because I've never used one. I'm just curious as to why it seems more people use them than an actual rotary polisher.
 
Because its dang near impossible to really mess up the paint, that being said a rotary is better for correcting. With pad technology and better DA's out now you can get almost as good results with a DA than you can with a rotary.
 
I would recommend more people try to rotary and to not be afraid. The modern pads and polishes are really user friendly. I've taught 2 employees to use a rotary in the past year and neither has burned a single edge or even left a car covered in swirls for that matter.

On the flip side, maybe I should try a DA? Is there any reason a guy who has used a rotary for almost 20 years would benefit from a DA?
 
DA's are safer and require less of a learning curve to use properly. DA compounding finishes hologram free and sometimes even mar free with only a little haze to clean up with a light finishing step. New dual action machines are very powerful and with the pad and liquid technology formulated for them, they can do just as much correction with less time refining. Rotary polishers will always have their place in the hands of a skilled artisan. I am a DA compounding fan boy but use a rotary on almost every detail to do small tight areas where I don't want the throw from a DA so I can have optimal control. RP's are also awesome for restoring headlights and drying out pads after you clean them!
 
If you can swing it, buy a Rupes 21, some Meguiar's Microfiber cutting discs and Meguiar's M101 Foam Cut Compound. I have personally never used this combo, but keep hearing and seeing anecdotes, videos, etc touting how much of a defect killing combo it is. I personally have used DA compounding methods to cut out 1500-2000 grit sanding scratches.
 
MidwayRec said:
When I learned to buff (as they used to call it I guess), everything was wool, high speed, and aggressive products. It was easy then to damage a finish with burns and swirls if you weren't careful.

Today, with the slower rotary speeds, the foam pads, and the versatile compounds and polishes, you'd have to be pretty care less to really damage a vehicle with a rotary.

With that being said, why use a DA? Seems like a rotary is much more effective at getting the jobs done and much faster as well.

I'm not knocking the DA polishers because I've never used one. I'm just curious as to why it seems more people use them than an actual rotary polisher.
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Probably once a week in my shop I see a mess from an inexperienced rotary user (I see a lot of new cars and dealer prep guys seem to also like the rotary)

So I disagree and feel its easier than you think to damage a finish with a rotary. You may not burn an edge like a wool pad at high speed but swirls, haze, buffer trails - all pretty typical I'm afraid. Every body shop I see finishes with a rotary and basically every one looks like crap once the glaze washes off
 
MidwayRec said:
I would recommend more people try to rotary and to not be afraid. The modern pads and polishes are really user friendly. I've taught 2 employees to use a rotary in the past year and neither has burned a single edge or even left a car covered in swirls for that matter.

On the flip side, maybe I should try a DA? Is there any reason a guy who has used a rotary for almost 20 years would benefit from a DA?
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do your employees buff under fluroscent lights only? or LED / halogen? I can make a car real shiny real easy under the fluros but the LEDs show you whats really going on
 
The only time a rotary should be used to finish is when the paint is corrected, then the burnishing/jewel in begins.
 
I'm a Rotary Power guy since I was around 10 years old..
Seen all the old lacquers, enamels, acrylics of each, Imron airplane paint, water based, etc., and I still turn out perfect work with a Rotary...

Seen the high speeds, and while they were needed back then, have always used lower speeds, and even several years ago, when I was still talking about lower speeds, and some people said I was doing it backwards, and not doing it right, my work speaks for itself...

I also see people in auto body and paint shops using a Rotary with big, dirty, pads, and cheap production compound products, and yeah, they can get painted and color sanded parts looking great.

Some have been taught by the better Painters how to use the machine so as to Not induce swirls, etc., and they will always look better than the rest who dont have the skills or the time to get it right the first time..

At the end of the day, the Rotary in the hands of a good user will always be faster and do so much more.. And no vibration, numbness of hands, fingers, etc..

If this were not the case, then the innumerable number of Rotaries used daily in every body shop, automotive factory, boat factory, airplane factory, and more, would have been already replaced with something else..
Dan F
 
Stokdgs said:
I'm a Rotary Power guy since I was around 10 years old..
Seen all the old lacquers, enamels, acrylics of each, Imron airplane paint, water based, etc., and I still turn out perfect work with a Rotary...

Seen the high speeds, and while they were needed back then, have always used lower speeds, and even several years ago, when I was still talking about lower speeds, and some people said I was doing it backwards, and not doing it right, my work speaks for itself...

I also see people in auto body and paint shops using a Rotary with big, dirty, pads, and cheap production compound products, and yeah, they can get painted and color sanded parts looking great.

Some have been taught by the better Painters how to use the machine so as to Not induce swirls, etc., and they will always look better than the rest who dont have the skills or the time to get it right the first time..

At the end of the day, the Rotary in the hands of a good user will always be faster and do so much more.. And no vibration, numbness of hands, fingers, etc..

If this were not the case, then the innumerable number of Rotaries used daily in every body shop, automotive factory, boat factory, airplane factory, and more, would have been already replaced with something else..
Dan F
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I dont doubt a word you said. but you're in the minority. I'm saying 90% of body shops by me leave the paint polishing to the cheap labor. One unskilled tech teaching the next unskilled tech. And it all looks fine under fluroscent lights. By the time the customer figures it out, who cares the shop got their insurance money.
 
I check everything with IPA wipe downs and an led flashlight. Plus as I am working, I have my halogen flood lights.

When you see a car heavily swirled from a body shop, it is simply because many shops still use high speed wool and the same cheap industrial compounds they have been using for decades. Also, volume shops just don't care. Some dealers run 100 cars a week at an auction and buff with pledge.

So, comparing our quality of knowledgable guys here with the class a products we are known to use, bringing a swirled car from a volume shop into the discussion is apples and oranges. You really would have to see what those guys are doing to understand.
 
Gurge said:
I dont doubt a word you said. but you're in the minority. I'm saying 90% of body shops by me leave the paint polishing to the cheap labor. One unskilled tech teaching the next unskilled tech. And it all looks fine under fluroscent lights. By the time the customer figures it out, who cares the shop got their insurance money.
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This is true. But I'm talking about the guys around here. They are into detailing enough to know to come here, buy the right things, use the right tools... These types of guys should be into rotaries, IMO. When you talk about these techs at the low grade shops, that still doesn't explain to me why knowledgable and careful guys fear using a rotary.
 
Yes it is!! I had my hood repainted by the best body shop in the county that does hot rods and custom paint jobs.

I guess they didn't know I was a detailer because the holograms in the hood were the very first thing I saw when I picked up my car. I went to high school with the detailer at the body shop. I ran into him a few weeks later at the store and was informed he used a 3m rotary with a light wool pad. Probably the same pad he used on the last 20 cars without washing...
 
MidwayRec said:
When I see someone say they took ten hours on paint correction using a DA :wall
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I get what your saying but there are sooooo many variables, soft paint, pad cleaning, water to polish ratio. All these have an effect on polishing speed, not to mention the time it does take to dial in. I'm not saying 10 is reasonable, I can finish down a Tahoe in less than 4 hours with a good da or Fr. To be honest the only time I use a rotary is for heavy cutting and super fine finishing. First in last out. Use a rupes, trust me it will save you tons of time.

Personally the rotary is not for beginners or 7$ an hour shop minions, I trust a surgeon with a scalpel to operate not the intern nurse...
 
Count me as a minority then, cause if I spent 25 hours on a car, it would be to prep for a paint job. The longest time I spent was on a black Dodge 2500 diesel, 4 x 4, quad cab with waterspots, oxidation, sap, swirls and a nasty film of diesel on it. I worked 14 hours and that included cleaning the interior too. The owner gave me a $40 tip and sent me his wife's Toyota the next week.
Process - wash, clay, waterspot remover, wash, M101 on MF pads, BFWD. Yes, I 1-stepped it and it looked great. Tip - small work areas and compressed air to clean pads after every section.
 
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