My first wet sanding Experience

[angryfx45]

My 2013 Audi Q5 was repainted on the hood and passenger side fender and the bumper from a front end accident.

The whole body work was good except for the huge amount of orange peel that actually made the black look dull.

Instead of the fresh painted part looking newer it looked as if the new parts were older.

I coulda taken it back to the shop to have it fixed but from the way they buffed the car, with holograms and etc etc i decided to tackle on the job myself.

I bought 6 pcs of 3000 grit, 2 2500 grit, 2 2000 grit.

I did not buy 1500 bcuz i was so scared i would go through the clear.

First impression of the 2000 3000 grit sandpaper was that when it was dry l, it was very soft and fine didnt even feel like sand paper.

So here are some b4 shots. Sorry for the crappy note 3 pics.

This is a double 4 feet Fl bulb.
See how there is not shine/ reflection/ depth at all--?

Short comparison to the Acura next to me at the lot (neighbors auto washed TL has deeper shine)TT

So i had sprayed a 2 by 2 area of the hood first and soaked the 2000 sand paper wet previously.

And did my first initial pass real carefully.

As you can see i was so scared i did maybe 2 3 passes and stop to wipe and check my result.

First impression of the wet sanding was unlike when it was dry. Once wet and rubbed against the hood of the car. It grabbed and kind of clung on to the paint.

It wasnt gliding rather biting the paint and i was using some force to push and pull.

Im not sure it this is the right way to wet sand but this is what i felt.

After a cp stroke i started getting the hang of it and knew when i was sanding and knew when i was gliding over the sheet of water.

And sped up my sanding. Paying attention to the edges and curves.

I was done with my initial passes and dried the hood and checked.

There still was high spots and i knew it wasnt good enough so i banged the parts out that valleys and peels were showing.

And here after i done the 2000 step i did a water wet test

Coated with just water the reflection shows better than b4 already.

Onto 3000 grit

Now the light fixture is actually showing its shape and under the 3000grit scratches now reflections were glowing

I knew i couldave done alil bit more but i was scared and wanted to buff it out and maybe resand againg if needed

Ill update later after i buff n polish




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M105 + MG MF cutting pad with makita wasnt cutting the fine 3000 grit scratches.

Damn so ill have to do this monday with my GG 6" when i have power supply and more time

 

[Accumulator]

angryfx45- Looks like you`re making good progress!

Be sure to get some good/appropriate lighting on the subject when you get to the latter steps. Lots of stuff requires Point Source Illumination if you want it to look OK in the sun. The Fluorescent tubes are great for texture though, so I bet that helped with gauging your progress during the wetsand.

 

[512detail]

wow, those pics scare me

still waiting to get a `test` panel before I try learning how to do that

 

[angryfx45]

angryfx45- Looks like you`re making good progress!

Be sure to get some good/appropriate lighting on the subject when you get to the latter steps. Lots of stuff requires Point Source Illumination if you want it to look OK in the sun. The Fluorescent tubes are great for texture though, so I bet that helped with gauging your progress during the wetsand.

thank you, and yes your completely right.

after my initial "light" pass with m105 it brought the shine back alittle bit but under the light therewere tons of
3000 grit scratches. Which i think will neeed alot of correction.

I had to lightly buff with m105 so my wife can drive it for cpla days until i have time perhaps monday!!!

 

[512detail]

this may be a dumb question.. but what is the cause of orange peel? scientifically

I view it as just unlevel paint or something similar

 

[angryfx45]

wow, those pics scare me

still waiting to get a `test` panel before I try learning how to do that

Yes and i went brave went straight without any previous practices but I knew it was a repaint = more clear towork with....

and i think its better to do very little strokes and smaller panel at a time. Check against light. my picture quality is really bad

but with naked eyes you will really see what your actually doing. I wont say its easy but not as scary as it looks!!!

 

[Accumulator]

..after my initial "light" pass with m105 it brought the shine back alittle bit but under the light therewere tons of 3000 grit scratches. Which i think will neeed alot of correction.

IME the M105 can handle 3K scratches, but yeah it does take a while. 4K is much easier if you have any handy (gee, guess you don`t or you woulda already used it...).

 

[angryfx45]

this may be a dumb question.. but what is the cause of orange peel? scientifically

I view it as just unlevel paint or something similar

Im not a pro at this, so my answer could be wrong.

technically i may have to do with air pressure in the spray gun, or just bad technique from the body shop.

or I personally think when the clear coat dries in an atmosphere thats not controlled it may dry uneven creating highs and lows..??? maybe...

 

[angryfx45]

IME the M105 can handle 3K scratches, but yeah it does take a while. 4K is much easier if you have any handy (gee, guess you don`t or you woulda already used it...).

i do have the car pro denim pads.... (initial bought those to fix the problem but they were not cutting it for this mess)
would the denim pads work similar to 4000 or 5000 grit?

TYI

 

[512detail]

Im not a pro at this, so my answer could be wrong.

technically i may have to do with air pressure in the spray gun, or just bad technique from the body shop.

or I personally think when the clear coat dries in an atmosphere thats not controlled it may dry uneven creating highs and lows..??? maybe...

I looked and looked for orange peel on the repaint areas on my SRT when I was polishing it down last year- never found any. . perhaps its there and I just cant see it but I don`t know

maybe the guys who painted my car were just That good

I know you can`t even tell it (rear quarter, fr passenger fender, bumper) was repainted, that`s for sure

 

[angryfx45]

I looked and looked for orange peel on the repaint areas on my SRT when I was polishing it down last year- never found any. . perhaps its there and I just cant see it but I don`t know

maybe the guys who painted my car were just That good

I know you can`t even tell it (rear quarter, fr passenger fender, bumper) was repainted, that`s for sure

It took me sometime b4 i can spot factory orange peels.. it`s like regular civilian coming out out a auto looking at their car and

saying " it`s spanking shining clean!!!"

But boy once those eyes open fogettaboutit

 

[XxBoostinxX]

this may be a dumb question.. but what is the cause of orange peel? scientifically

I view it as just unlevel paint or something similar

Usually it is from spraying the clear too thick.

 

[512detail]

Usually it is from spraying the clear too thick.

clear wasters!

 

[BudgetPlan1]

Im not a pro at this, so my answer could be wrong.

technically i may have to do with air pressure in the spray gun, or just bad technique from the body shop.

or I personally think when the clear coat dries in an atmosphere thats not controlled it may dry uneven creating highs and lows..??? maybe...

Dunno what causes it but the Corvette plant in Bowling Green has been a master at producing it for many years.

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[Accumulator]

The OP on my S8 is simply *TERRIBLE* on a few panels despite their then-new robotic paint system. Oddly enough the A8 (same plant, same paint, built a few months earlier) isn`t as bad. I just live with it as I`m all about thick clear.

Heh heh, the reshot front bumpercover and hood of the Crown Vic are so bad that the texture makes the paint appear semi-matte despite proper polishing! No, I`m not leveling that either. OP is something that just doesn`t bother me for some reason...same with most paintchips and also dents even when they`re prett bad. Now wash-induced cobweb-marring or a hologram? Wouldn`t take it down the driveway with flaws like those, but chips, dents, and OP are OK. Everybody`s different...

 

[angryfx45]

Slight update, had about 2 hrs to work in the car again. I just did the lower part of the hood kind of a 50/50 shot after a long careful pass with m100 W/micro fiber cutting pad.

I kinda like this better than the m105 W mf cutting pad.

I think it will take a good 3 passes with either 105 or 100.

Hopefully ill have some more time sooooon

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[angryfx45]

The OP on my S8 is simply *TERRIBLE* on a few panels despite their then-new robotic paint system. Oddly enough the A8 (same plant, same paint, built a few months earlier) isn`t as bad. I just live with it as I`m all about thick clear.

Heh heh, the reshot front bumpercover and hood of the Crown Vic are so bad that the texture makes the paint appear semi-matte despite proper polishing! No, I`m not leveling that either. OP is something that just doesn`t bother me for some reason...same with most paintchips and also dents even when they`re prett bad. Now wash-induced cobweb-marring or a hologram? Wouldn`t take it down the driveway with flaws like those, but chips, dents, and OP are OK. Everybody`s different...

Yup factory orange peels dont bother me but this repaint was a horrid.

Just pure UGLY.



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[JustJesus]

...

I coulda taken it back to the shop to have it fixed but from the way they buffed the car, with holograms and etc etc i decided to tackle on the job myself.

i chatted online with some guy who had similar experience. He *did* take it back, and unfortunately, they made it worse! Ruined other panels that they shouldn`t even have touched. nasty. So you may have saved yourself some headaches.

I bought 6 pcs of 3000 grit, 2 2500 grit, 2 2000 grit.

I did not buy 1500 bcuz i was so scared i would go through the clear.

I know the feeling. There`s so much fear put into us "new" guys that we might get overly cautious. But, to me, that`s a good thing!

----

Okay, hopefully I can give you some pointers and you won`t take it negatively. Some constructive criticism. Just so we`re clear, I AM NOT A PROFESSIONAL. Nor am I a seasoned veteran in the field. But I like to tinker and DIY when I can.

First... You want to use a thin tape, I like 3M`s thin 1/4" blue vinyl. Or maybe it`s 1/8" (?) - tape off the high points and edges. In your case, the edges of the hood, and you have at least two body lines that run front to back. You want to tape those off for sanding. Why? Paint tends to be thinner in those areas, as gravity does it`s thing and paint gets drawn down. It would be easier to burn through those edges and lines.

So i had sprayed a 2 by 2 area of the hood first and soaked the 2000 sand paper wet previously.

And did my first initial pass real carefully.

As you can see i was so scared i did maybe 2 3 passes and stop to wipe and check my result.

For being your first time, I`d say this isn`t bad. I`ve seen worse. Way worse. When it comes to sanding, especially by hand (BTW, you did this by hand, right?) you want to do many strokes, close together. You want to move little by little. So if you`re going from left to right, move a little bit at a time. A 1/4 of an inch? I`m sure people have different opinions on this. But if you look at your pic above, you can see those "high" spots, the glossy parts. You want to avoid that, and get a more uniform finish.

In my thread here, http://www.autopia.org/forums/click...ts-poorboys-world-smorgasbord.html?highlight= ,you can see in my first pass I had some "gaps." That`s what we want to avoid. But looking at the other pics, you can see how it is more uniform as I did more. That was done by hand. I`ve found that doing it by machine, you get a much more uniform finish. You can see some of that on this thread here... http://www.autopia.org/forums/machi...aro-5-step-compounds-polishes.html?highlight=

First impression of the wet sanding was unlike when it was dry. Once wet and rubbed against the hood of the car. It grabbed and kind of clung on to the paint.

It wasnt gliding rather biting the paint and i was using some force to push and pull.

Im not sure it this is the right way to wet sand but this is what i felt.

From what I gather, you do not want it to be grabby. On the other hand, you also don`t want it to just *glide* over the surface either, sort of like hydroplaning. Using "some force" to push and pull sounds kind of bad. Not sure how much force you used, but IME, you don`t need a whole lot.

Paying attention to the edges and curves.

Good man!

I was done with my initial passes and dried the hood and checked.

There still was high spots and i knew it wasnt good enough so i banged the parts out that valleys and peels were showing.

Again, you want to shoot for some consistency in the finish. You want it to be uniform. As much as possible. Doing this work here, will get you better results later, when you`re done with the polishing.

I knew i couldave done alil bit more but i was scared and wanted to buff it out and maybe resand againg if needed

I`m curious to know how much paint (clear) you have on there.

I gotta go, but I`ll see if I can add more to this later....

 

[angryfx45]

i chatted online with some guy who had similar experience. He *did* take it back, and unfortunately, they made it worse! Ruined other panels that they shouldn`t even have touched. nasty. So you may have saved yourself some headaches.



I know the feeling. There`s so much fear put into us "new" guys that we might get overly cautious. But, to me, that`s a good thing!

----

Okay, hopefully I can give you some pointers and you won`t take it negatively. Some constructive criticism. Just so we`re clear, I AM NOT A PROFESSIONAL. Nor am I a seasoned veteran in the field. But I like to tinker and DIY when I can.

First... You want to use a thin tape, I like 3M`s thin 1/4" blue vinyl. Or maybe it`s 1/8" (?) - tape off the high points and edges. In your case, the edges of the hood, and you have at least two body lines that run front to back. You want to tape those off for sanding. Why? Paint tends to be thinner in those areas, as gravity does it`s thing and paint gets drawn down. It would be easier to burn through those edges and lines.



For being your first time, I`d say this isn`t bad. I`ve seen worse. Way worse. When it comes to sanding, especially by hand (BTW, you did this by hand, right?) you want to do many strokes, close together. You want to move little by little. So if you`re going from left to right, move a little bit at a time. A 1/4 of an inch? I`m sure people have different opinions on this. But if you look at your pic above, you can see those "high" spots, the glossy parts. You want to avoid that, and get a more uniform finish.

In my thread here, http://www.autopia.org/forums/click...ts-poorboys-world-smorgasbord.html?highlight= ,you can see in my first pass I had some "gaps." That`s what we want to avoid. But looking at the other pics, you can see how it is more uniform as I did more. That was done by hand. I`ve found that doing it by machine, you get a much more uniform finish. You can see some of that on this thread here... http://www.autopia.org/forums/machi...aro-5-step-compounds-polishes.html?highlight=




From what I gather, you do not want it to be grabby. On the other hand, you also don`t want it to just *glide* over the surface either, sort of like hydroplaning. Using "some force" to push and pull sounds kind of bad. Not sure how much force you used, but IME, you don`t need a whole lot.




Good man!




Again, you want to shoot for some consistency in the finish. You want it to be uniform. As much as possible. Doing this work here, will get you better results later, when you`re done with the polishing.




I`m curious to know how much paint (clear) you have on there.

I gotta go, but I`ll see if I can add more to this later....

The whole point of me putting my first exp was to get pointer criticism etc etc. So i really appreciate it and thank you!!!

I did tape off the side edges of the hood. Also the front hood line curves i actually did not even sand bcuz i was scared of burning through.

But like u said if i had those thinner tapes yes it would be much better.

My stroking was actually somewhat very long maybe half an arm length at first and it gradually got smaller as i passively learned the techniques.

But it still wasnt very short. So ill need to fix that in the future.


The amount of clear put on? Honestly i have no idea aside from it being a genral body shop job.
Im assuming it was a typical amount 2 coats maybe so i am never going to be redoing the full panel just where there may be too much orange peel? .. but after i buff & polish i might not even touch it, being that i will be coating it with CQuartz uk once im done in a matter of days to weeks.

Again thank you for the comment. And i have learned a great deal from your experience. And im able to understand better, now that i have my own experience also.






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[Stokdgs]

Congrats on taking this project on without any experience !

What would have made the sanding easier,uniform, and flatter, would have been to use a 3M black rubber sanding block and water constantly running on the panel being sanded, or a bucket of clean water with a few drops of soap and a big sponge, to make the water more slippery..

Assume the paint shop sanded the areas flat to begin with and that will help you get a better result after all the compounding you have to do..

Is that black paint a jet black or a metallic black ? It looks like a jet black from here so far...

Audi factory paint is pretty hard as are most German car paint so if they used the Factory Pack paint, then it will still act almost the same..

Assume you waited long enough for the paint to dry and cure before you started this, right ?

When I painted in shops, the only way you would get orange peel would be if you applied the paint too dry...

You have to paint it so it is wet enough that it will self level and come out pretty darn smooth and glossy..
Then, there is less work to do at the compounding stage in the process..

You are doing a great job !
Good luck !
Dan F