Official Discussion: Auto Detail Certification

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vanev

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Official Discussion: Auto Detail Certification

This is a subject that comes up on this forum from time to time.
It will come up again as new generations of Auto Detailers start their own business.
The purpose of having an Official Discussion Thread on this, or any subject, is to have a central thread location for a subject matter that will inevitably keep popping up.
The benefits relate to research more than anything else.
Such a specific Thread can be referred to and referenced.
Generally these are Necro Exempt as information, evolution in technology, and people's views are always ever changing.

I will begin by asking some questions:
- Do you believe in the concept of an official licensing body crediting certification in the Auto Detail Business?

- Do you believe having suh a certification be mandated by law to obtain in order to go into business as an Auto Detailer?

- Do you believe having such an official certification would add credibility to the industry of Auto Detailing?

- Do you believe having such an official certification would better educate consumers on what exactly auto detailing is and how it is different than a guy with a bucket of soap&water hustling to sell car washes for cheap?

- Do you believe having such an official certification would add/offer any legal protection from non certified self proclaimed Auto Detailers under charging and thus undercutting pricing?
* Think Anti-Trust Law as well as a legal penalty/fine for performing a service when not certified.

- Do you believe having such an official certification would create better skilled Auto Detailers?

Relevant Quote:
Mike Phillips
Auto Detailing Certification - Auto Geek Online Auto Detailing Forum
I am posting this so that Mr. Mike Phillips does not feel the need to endlessly say the same thing over and over again related to this topic of discussion.
It is relevant and is worth citing.
Mike.Phillips@Autogeek said:
Great idea and good question, here's the problem everyone and anyone teaching classes on this topic runs into.
Even if you teach a guy the right way to do things, after he leaves he can flash his certification and then do hack work with lousy products. This makes the company that awarded the certification look bad.
That's why at Meguiar's and now here at Autogeek we award a,
Certificate of Completion
That means you were here, attended the class and completed it.

Also, as I'm sure others will bring up, there are so many products, pads, tools and techniques to reach the goal, (a clean shiny car), and for the most part all the different approaches "can" work.
That is there is no right or wrong way to approach getting a car clean and shiny if the end results is a professional job that pleases the customer.
The problem lies with people that do lousy work which I explain in detail in this article,
The story of 3 H's - Horrendous, Horror Story and Hack Detailers... - Auto Geek Online Auto Detailing Forum

I'm all for the idea though... now figuring out a way to accomplish the goal.
For what it's worth, I helped out a guy via e-mail today that bought a brand new Infinity from an Infinity dealership and the paint was a wreck when he picked up the car. He sent me at least a dozen pictures.

Shouldn't the detailer at a Infinity Dealership be qualified to "touch" the paint on a brand new Infinity without ruining it for the customer? Again, read through the article above, I spent a lot of time writing it to explain the problems without carelessly blaming everyone in this industry for doing hack work.
Click to expand...
 
The better question is who is going to enforce this idea. Say someone is certified and decides to hack up cars anyway? I certainly don't think I'll ever see the swirl police inspecting my work and possibly issuing fines or threatening my certification.

Its a great idea and all just something I don't see as realistic. Let the public spotlight be your certification. Reviews on Google/Facebook etc are a powerful thing
 
Ronkh said:
I don't need no stinkin certification. I can hack up a car without one.
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ShaneB said:
The better question is who is going to enforce this idea. Say someone is certified and decides to hack up cars anyway? I certainly don't think I'll ever see the swirl police inspecting my work and possibly issuing fines or threatening my certification.

Its a great idea and all just something I don't see as realistic. Let the public spotlight be your certification. Reviews on Google/Facebook etc are a powerful thing
Click to expand...

I think there is a misunderstanding.
A certification will never prevent someone from doing a poor job nor will there be law enforcement inspecting anyone's work.

Just as there are plenty of people who know how to work on cars and fix engines and transmissions, one must be certified and meet standards to become an actual auto mechanic.
The same principle applies.
Certification will not stop anyone who is intent on breaking rules, hustling, committing fraud, etc...
What it does is give the consumer a baseline to judge the credibility of the one selling the service.

In regards to legal protection, it can be a deterrent in some respects for someone who is not certified and intends to go door to door, put up flyers, or just hustle the streets selling car washes.
If there was a law mandating one must obtain certification to sell such services, then that same person could be subject to legal penalty for operating such a business without proper certification.
Similar to operating a business without a license.

Certification does not guarantee anything.
It would be unrealistic for anyone to have such miraculous expectations
What it can do is offer a lot more than what is available today for the professional auto detailer.
 
I am certifiable. For sure.

You should need a license for a rotary. And need to take another test every year starting at age 65

Should not be able to buy iron x unless you are over 21
 
JSFM35X said:
I am certifiable. For sure.

You should need a license for a rotary. And need to take another test every year starting at age 65 --------------

I will be happy to take that test anytime...And then every year..... :)
Dan F
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Before my life imploded, I used to get a Monthly newspaper from some Detailing certification place that had Detailing articles from some of the Detailers on the Board...
I remember one of them being a gentlemen named Bud Abraham I believe...
Is this the same place, Vanev ??
Do you know what I am referring to ?
Thanks,
Dan F
 
I believe your auto mechanic example is not very accurate because certifying mechanics is a matter of public safety.

I mean, I get where you're coming from, but somehow the whole idea would need to be paid for, and I'd rather see tax dollars used elsewhere. Nor would I like anymore yearly fees to run my business.
 
Way back in the early 70's I was playing tennis and stringing tennis racquets, a group was established to certify and oversee the art of stringing racquets, the United States Racquet Stringers Association or USRSA. They came up with a criterion and a test and when you passed your test you were allowed to call yourself a certified stringer or later a master racquet technician. I never took the test or became certified, but it did not stop me from stringing racquets. The main reason I did not become certified was twofold, it was expensive and the certification test was nowhere near where I lived. I believe a detailer certification would be a good idea because of what I saw in the USRSA. The organization set forth minimum requirements to call yourself certified, it also allowed members to share ideas, they tested products and furthered the idea that there was a right way and a wrong way or a better way to string racquets. If you are making money from a business it would be a very good idea to be a member of a professional organization. I still keep up with the USRSA, I was member number 71 and now the organization has thousands of members. Would I become a certified detailer? Depends on the cost and benefits. I am truly surprised that someone has not tried to organized one, it would be beneficial to sort out those that are trying to be professional and those that are fly by nighters. Beneficial to customers and members alike. It would not stop someone from hacking up your car, but at least you would have an idea that the person you took your car to had the mentality to join a professional organization and also the customer would have a place to air their grievances if detailing work was not done up to par.
 
Certification for auto mechanics is a state by state issue. Some states require certification/licensing for mechanics and other states don't. Washington State does not require certification.
 
I am a licensed professional engineer in my home state, I am also registered with the national council (NCEES) so that I can obtain engineering licensure in other states more easily. My licensure is a matter of life safety, but there are plenty of folks far more knowledgeable and experienced than I that never got a license or aren't qualified to obtain one.

Here's the thing with my state's engineering board as I read the newsletter about who got in trouble:

If you call yourself an engineer and you are not an engineer, you get a slap on the wrist; if you are a professional, allow your license to lapse and sign/stamp/certify documents during that time, you may owe 5-figures if you certified too many documents.

There is minimal repercussion for those who aren't licensed and severe repercussions for those who are. If not legally obligated to be licensed, why would I choose to be?

Can't think of the last time I went into a mechanic or other basic service provider and looked for a certification on the wall. I went there because they have a reputation for quality work.

That said, for customers not familiar with detailing, being able to point to a certification would lend credibility.
 
I look at a certificate for detailing like i do the MECP (Mobile Electronics Certification Program). I think its cool, but in the end it is a test you take, study the guide and remember the answers and pass a test. It means NOTHING as to how good of an installer you are. I had my certification for 4 years and it did 0 for my "career". Not sure how many customers would care if you passed a written test for detailing. Or if you flew to Cali and took a course. It seems more important to some detailers than it does to car owners.
 
I just printed a stack of certificates for detailers. I will be holding a class this Saturday in my Carage.

The Class is $ 1,500 bucks for the hour and it includes drinking water.

This will get you the level one Silver certificate, If you also desire advanced detailing and the schmooze certificate on how to increase your profitability by attracting the 1% its and additional 1,500 bucks and just stick around for an extra 15 minutes after everyone else leaves so I can print up some certificates on the gold paper. If this goes well I will hold a class next Saturday for the platinum session where we will show you how to talk your customers into the new Acme mega powered diamonite crystal serpent super super coating I have been developing. This will be a very exclusive class available only to those who can pre pay $ 9,500.00 for the class. Refreshments will be served at this class.

Sign up below: (let me know if you want the Silver or Silver and Gold so I know how much of each color paper to get.)
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JSFM35X said:
I just printed a stack of certificates for detailers. I will be holding a class this Saturday in my Carage.

The Class is $ 1,500 bucks for the hour and it includes drinking water.

This will get you the level one Silver certificate, If you also desire advanced detailing and the schmooze certificate on how to increase your profitability by attracting the 1% its and additional 1,500 bucks and just stick around for an extra 15 minutes after everyone else leaves so I can print up some certificates on the gold paper. If this goes well I will hold a class next Saturday for the platinum session where we will show you how to talk your customers into the new Acme mega powered diamonite crystal serpent super super coating I have been developing. This will be a very exclusive class available only to those who can pre pay $ 9,500.00 for the class. Refreshments will be served at this class.

Sign up below: (let me know if you want the Silver or Silver and Gold so I know how much of each color paper to get.)
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2.
3.
4.
5.
Click to expand...

I want a platinum one. But don't want to pay for it. It's my right as an American to have everything handed to me.
 
JSFM35X said:
I just printed a stack of certificates for detailers. I will be holding a class this Saturday in my Carage.

The Class is $ 1,500 bucks for the hour and it includes drinking water.

This will get you the level one Silver certificate, If you also desire advanced detailing and the schmooze certificate on how to increase your profitability by attracting the 1% its and additional 1,500 bucks and just stick around for an extra 15 minutes after everyone else leaves so I can print up some certificates on the gold paper. If this goes well I will hold a class next Saturday for the platinum session where we will show you how to talk your customers into the new Acme mega powered diamonite crystal serpent super super coating I have been developing. This will be a very exclusive class available only to those who can pre pay $ 9,500.00 for the class. Refreshments will be served at this class.

Sign up below: (let me know if you want the Silver or Silver and Gold so I know how much of each color paper to get.)
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
Click to expand...

I have appointed myself the official auditing agency of your certification program. Below is a list of items that need to be addressed prior to receiving your accreditation as a certification program.

1. A bronze level for those under 18 and pets.
2. Minimum 145gsm cardstock for printing certificates.
3. Must serve chips and guac at silver training.
4. Silver training must have protocol for cleaning chips and guac from vehicle interiors.
 
BTW, I am a certified ------ inspector. And I have the T shirt to prove it!

(and ______) is not a bankable word please.

Anyone remember when %$#&^% was always typed before blackfire?
 
Taking out your competition by increasing government regulation?
C 'mon man!
I think the industry does just fine without certification.
Just remember- having a certificate in anything doesn't prove competency.
 
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Audios S6 said:
I am a licensed professional engineer in my home state, I am also registered with the national council (NCEES) so that I can obtain engineering licensure in other states more easily. My licensure is a matter of life safety, but there are plenty of folks far more knowledgeable and experienced than I that never got a license or aren't qualified to obtain one.

Here's the thing with my state's engineering board as I read the newsletter about who got in trouble:

If you call yourself an engineer and you are not an engineer, you get a slap on the wrist; if you are a professional, allow your license to lapse and sign/stamp/certify documents during that time, you may owe 5-figures if you certified too many documents.

There is minimal repercussion for those who aren't licensed and severe repercussions for those who are. If not legally obligated to be licensed, why would I choose to be?

Can't think of the last time I went into a mechanic or other basic service provider and looked for a certification on the wall. I went there because they have a reputation for quality work.

That said, for customers not familiar with detailing, being able to point to a certification would lend credibility.
Click to expand...

I don't see the point of it for many of the reasons above. I'm all for continuing education and training, but don't 100% believe in the need for certification in our industry. The point's mentioned in bold by Bob are key points for me. People don't come to me because of a certification and I've never had someone do work for me either where I chose them based on a certification. I do my research and find someone with good reviews or from a referral.
 
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