Zaino Bonding Question

T

topnotchtouch

New member
I hope this thread doesn't spiral into a flame war so I am going to try and ask this as delicately as possible.



Even though it is not my favorite product I do use Zaino. I have always understood that you had to remove ALL oils from the paint prior to application. I accepted this as part of the process. Just saw this thread that seems to indicate that Sal says you can use 3M SMR and then apply Zaino right over it without removing the oils. I have seen the MSDS for 3M SMR here and it does contain mineral oils (granted not much). I am really confused now.



Has anyone actually tested this to see if Zaino will bond over different surface prep products, carnauba waxes or even other sealants?
 
I tried Z5 over AIO and didn't see any problem with that.I still had this combo on my roof for about 6 weeks before putting another layer of Z2 on.I also used the NXT booster on the roof about a week before I used Z2.
 
04BlackAV said:
I tried Z5 over AIO and didn't see any problem with that.I still had this combo on my roof for about 6 weeks before putting another layer of Z2 on.I also used the NXT booster on the roof about a week before I used Z2.
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Did you notice any difference in the time it took for the Z5 or Z2 to cure before you wiped it off? Any smearing or streaking?



I would really like to try it myself but, I just don't have the time and the weather here is going to be nasty for at least the next week.
 
I didn't notice any difference using AIO verus's a isa/water wipe down.It was in the low 70's and no humidity and dried in a normol amount of time for the weather.No smearing or streaking.



Here is what I did.



1Z PP-MP

AIO

Next day

Z7 wash

Z6

Z5/ZFX x3

Z6
 
~One man’s opinion / observations ~



Surface Preparation-



a) Wash vehicle with a good quality car wash concentrate (Zaino Z-7) rinse and dry thoroughly.

b) Remove any imbedded contaminants with detailing clay

c) Remove any surface imperfections with a suitable machine polish or a swirl mark remover (3M's PI-III MG, P/N 05397) for hand or machine application

d) Clean paint film surface with a pre-wax cleaner (P21S Gloss Enhancing Paintwork Cleaner)

e) Finally wash paint surface with a car wash concentrate (Zaino Z-7)

f) Dry thoroughly and start applying Zaino Z-5 / Z-2 with ZFX.



This preparation method provides the resin (paint) system with necessary oils from 3M / GEPC, plus you'll get some extra gloss/shine and added durability.



(Footnote: I hope we don't now become anti-Zanio and have to apologise for using what is after all a good product)





Experience unshared; is knowledge wasted…/



justadumbarchitect *so I question everything*
 
TOGWT,



I follow a pretty similar routine on a couple of family member's cars that I use Zaino on but, are there really going to be any oils left after step d and e. Sure there may be some left in the poors and imperfections of the paint but, from the thread I posted above Sal seems to indicate that you can use 3M SMR and then immediately follow that with Z5 without any type of cleaning or washing between.



I would have thought a lot more people would have experimented with Zaino to see what you could actually get away with. This is Autopia after all where we don't necessarily always follow the directions :D
 
I've done PPCL and then Zaino right over it without any problems. Sometimes after you finishing your prep phase, you don't want to wash the car again because it just looks good.



I read something in the past where someone was saying that not doing that last wash might shorten the life of the Zaino. Maybe get 4 months instead of 6 ? I feel like I got a good 6 months out of my Fall '03 overhaul with a brutal Northeast winter.
 
~One man’s opinion / observations ~



Rjstaaf- step d) P21S has oils in it, step e) should be a light wash (ie 0.5 oz Z-7 per gallon

That the oils are only in the microscopic pores of the resin (paint) no data to back it up, but the unscientific answer is “It works for me so that’s what I do�



If anybody has hints, tips, or corrections to the above procedure, please post them, I’m always anxious to improve my technique.



Experience unshared; is knowledge wasted…/



justadumbarchitect *so I question everything*
 
Luster said:
At Sal's recommendation I applied both Z5 and Z2 over 3M/SMR and it worked great. No bonding problems, and a very slick shine.
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Luster,



With no wash of any kind in between? I am wondering if this would work with other SMRs like #9 for one. I would think oils are oils, why 3m specifically?



Thanks for the reply :D
 
rjstaaf said:
Luster,



With no wash of any kind in between? I am wondering if this would work with other SMRs like #9 for one. I would think oils are oils, why 3m specifically?



Thanks for the reply :D
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That's correct. I went immediately from 3M/SMR to Z5.



2nd question.....I can't answer.
 
~One man’s opinion / observations ~



rjstaaf -Add a layer of liquid Carnauba wax to a paste Carnauba wax; allow it to cross-linking for 2-4 hours, to produce a deep ‘wet-look’ shine.



~Hope this helps~



Experience unshared; is knowledge wasted…/Jon

justadumbarchitect *so I question everything*
 
Like this :D



2760hood726.jpg




Actually that is #7 topped with #26(liquid) but, I have topped #16 with #26(liquid) and I currently have #26(paste) topped with #16 on my paint right now.



I have been and still am a looonnnnggg time carnauba user. I have just recently gotten into sealants and am just playing around trying to learn about the different systems. This is why all the Zaino questions. I also have the Klasse twins but, have yet to try them so you can probably expect some Klasse questions coming up soon :)



What has me questioning about oils is that I had always understood that you had to remove "all oils" from the paint prior to applying Zaino and now that doesn't seem entirely accurate so I am wondering just what you can get away with. What would make Zaino soo much more user friendly is if you could top it with a carnauba as so many do and yet still be able to add a fresh coat of Zaino without first having to remove the carnauba.



Thanks
 
~One man’s opinion / observations ~



I think Sal’s comment on ‘no oils’ is stated as a fail-safe, it’s been my experience that it will bond with the 3M and P21S products (previous post) providing you ‘lightly’ wash the vehicle before applying Z-2 / Z-5.



Like you I started out with Carnauba waxes (four plus decades ago) before I was introduced to the (then) wonder of polymer resins (‘60s era Klasse and Autoglym)





~Hope this helps~



Experience unshared; is knowledge wasted…/Jon

justadumbarchitect *so I question everything*
 
I think TOGWT has the right idea. The *IDEAL* surface for maximum durability would be one that is free of oils and waxes, however, I've applied Zaino the same way Luster has (i.e. right on top of polishes as well as glazes) with perfectly fine results. 3M, Meguiar's, P21S, KAIO...doesn't matter... I've applied Zaino over all of these with no problems at all.



Also, if you use Z-1 prior to applying the sealant, then IMO, the oils/fillers from the prep would be even less of a concern.



In terms of applying fresh layers of Zaino over your carnauba topper, I've never tried that before. But quite honestly, how long does a carnauba topper last? 2 months? 3 months at most? I don't think there would be any problem with adding extra layers of sealant right on top of carnauba wax once at that point.



If you have Klasse already, I think you'll like how the Klasse + carnauba combo looks much more than the Zaino + carnuaba look. Is there a reason you want to switch to the sealan/carnauba topper combo? IMO, glaze + sealant looks better. :)
 
Intermezzo said:


If you have Klasse already, I think you'll like how the Klasse + carnauba combo looks much more than the Zaino + carnuaba look. Is there a reason you want to switch to the sealan/carnauba topper combo? IMO, glaze + sealant looks better. :)
Click to expand...



Thanks for the input, it is much appreciated :wavey



I wouldn't really say that I am switching, just trying something new :xyxthumbs
 
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