Intermezzo was kind enought to chat with me about using Z.
I asked him to talk to other Z users on what would be a good comparison to my current wax combo. I wanted something that would take 4-5 days in my garage and then I wouldn't be QDing or topping (only washing) as I do with Klasse for 6 months.
Here is are convo if you would like to read it
> hey
<Intermezzo> Steve, so instead of buying ZFX from a distributor, you want to buy it from a user?
<Intermezzo> hi
> I want to buy enough to use it once
> the way I would be using it, if I were to buy it
<Intermezzo> OIC!
> and apply it twice a year
> if I like it
> maybe I'll use it
> you see how well Klasse works on my car already, I want to see what Z can do
> and I want an AGREED combo so that no one will be skeptical
<Intermezzo> Yeah, your car looks killer... you're going to compare shine, slickness, etc?
> I'm going to compare everything
> but basically my gut feeling
> like when I'm washing the car
> and when I'm driving in the rain
> and when I'm drying
> Klasse enhances all of that
<Intermezzo> I can tell you right now that I highly doubt Sal is going to agree to this...
> I have a ton of pictures
<Intermezzo> oh, OK....very extensive
> so if he doesn't agree then Klasse wins
> cause that's the method I use for Klasse
<Intermezzo> But some others like Metallic Mike, might be open to it
<Intermezzo> I guess it would all depend on exactly how formal of an agreement you were looking for
> or we should all adopt my answer for Z or K?
> which is
> if you like to wax often use Z
> and if you don't use K
> (even if Z lasts 6 months)
<Intermezzo> Do you think that would be a good standard answer?
> that's what I don't get, if I get Z and it'll last 6 months then I won't be able to use it that way in which I use it only twice a year?
> Intermezzo, can I copy and paste this convo?
<Intermezzo> of course...
> I think that maybe if they can see our dialog then they they'll understand what I'm saying better.
<Intermezzo> while it's true that most Z users wax often, I just don't think that that is the determining fact when explaining the difference between Klasse and Zaino
<Intermezzo> sure.. no prob.
<Intermezzo> I meant determining factor...
<Intermezzo> let me ask you something..
> If I like Z then I'll be the one that says you can use this combo _________________ etc, etc and only use it twice a year
> but you guys have to let me get to that point and not give me examples of how fun it is to wax every month
> hence the test
> (shoot with the question)
> Intermezzo, I meant cut and paste our convo for posting on Autopia
<Intermezzo> Yeah, I guess that would be fine.
<Intermezzo> What would be your guess as to why Zaino users layer and layer and layer frequently, but Klasse users do a major detailing session twice a year?
> I have no answer for that question. I posted why I do it twice a year. (cause I only wax a prestine car, one that's been AIO'd, PPCL) Klasse is soo damn durable, I'm never going lock in any dirt as much as I can.
> it's the same reason why I only QD after a wash
> perhaps Zaino users layer and layer because it looks better every time
<Intermezzo> ok
> under my theory, I can only do that for a week, cause otherwise I wouldn't get to drive my car due to the fact that I don't like to wax a non-prepped car
> well I guess I could garage it until I get 20 coats of Z whatever, but that's not practical. for K I garage it for a week and work my way up 5 coats cause of the cure time
<Intermezzo> I see. Because you feel that driving it around, washing it, and then adding a coat of polymer would lock in contaminants?
> it has before
<Intermezzo> Did you try claying out the contaminant when you discovered it?
> my first Klasse job, I locked in rail rust, couldn't even feel it with your fingers anymore
> I was young an ignorant back then
<Intermezzo> hehe, I've done pretty bad stuff myself!
> well I had gotten soo tired of putting on all that Klasse, I skimped on the rail rust. I had realized the error of my ways
> but I wasn't going to strip
> so are we on the same page?
<Intermezzo> OK, so I'll ask a few of the Zaino users I talk to on occassion and see if they'll give you an 'informal' approval of your plan (with or without a few changes) to apply Zaino
<Intermezzo> yup, I follow you!
> then I can spend a weekend (and a few days) put the stuff on, and just carry on with just washing for 6 months
<Intermezzo> (cont) to apply Zaino on your car and compare it with Klasse
> yeah, applying it once
<Intermezzo> yeah, the plan I gave you allows for just two days of detailing...
> I just want experienced Z users to agree on an even comparison
> because let's say I just choose 1 coat of Z5 as the comparsion
> everyone will fret
> so give me your best
<Intermezzo> right right.. The only thing they are approving or agreeing on is the Zaino plan which would be a good comparison to what you've been doing with Klasse...
<Intermezzo> is that right?
> yes, thank you very much
<Intermezzo> ok....
> all this stems from, every time I ask why people keep adding Z, they answer because it's fun. yeah, I get it, but that does nothing for me
<Intermezzo> Well, part of the reason why I do it is for enjoyment, but Zaino, like Klasse, is very layerable...so there's an increase in shine and reflectivity with each coat....
<Intermezzo> granted, there are diminishing returns the higher you go though...
> Klasse hit's a limit IMO
> after the 5th coat it started to feel rubbery and smell like Klasse
<Intermezzo> I see.. hmmm
> that was under the best conditions
<Intermezzo> because when I see some of the pics over at the corvette forum.. Man, those guys are insane.. They regularly do 30, 40, 50, 100 coats a year..but their cars are just incredible...
> since I was layering every day in a closed environment
<Intermezzo> Some of the pics I see there put Autopian pics to shame....
<Intermezzo> YoSteve, I see what you are saying. That's interesting.. I heard David B had over ten coats once.. Maybe it wasnt under ideal conditions though
> we have no way of determining if 100 coats in 1 year = 100 coats on your car unless it was garaged the whole time
> 1 klasser has 20 coats of SG
> completely loves it
<Intermezzo> I'm sure there was some degradation of the older layers....But you know what I mean. To be technical, we can call it 100 applications...
> I have would like to put on 5 solid layers of Z but I need to know which combo would be best
<Intermezzo> well, on silver, it's not as critical. Especially with a swirl-free car like yours. I would say the best combo would be 3-4 coats of Z-5 followed by 1-2 coats of Z-2
> I wonder how much scrutiny will be involved if I don't like the combo you guys agree on
<Intermezzo> What kind of combo would you not like?
<Intermezzo> I mean....
<Intermezzo> there's a possibility you might not like our detailing schedule we suggest?
> no
> if it can be done in a garage in 4-5 days then i'm golden
<Intermezzo> Oh, that shouldn't be a problem
> that's what I would do for Klasse
<Intermezzo> ok, that sounds good
> cool
> postin now
I asked him to talk to other Z users on what would be a good comparison to my current wax combo. I wanted something that would take 4-5 days in my garage and then I wouldn't be QDing or topping (only washing) as I do with Klasse for 6 months.
Here is are convo if you would like to read it
> hey
<Intermezzo> Steve, so instead of buying ZFX from a distributor, you want to buy it from a user?
<Intermezzo> hi
> I want to buy enough to use it once
> the way I would be using it, if I were to buy it
<Intermezzo> OIC!
> and apply it twice a year
> if I like it
> maybe I'll use it
> you see how well Klasse works on my car already, I want to see what Z can do
> and I want an AGREED combo so that no one will be skeptical
<Intermezzo> Yeah, your car looks killer... you're going to compare shine, slickness, etc?
> I'm going to compare everything
> but basically my gut feeling
> like when I'm washing the car
> and when I'm driving in the rain
> and when I'm drying
> Klasse enhances all of that
<Intermezzo> I can tell you right now that I highly doubt Sal is going to agree to this...
> I have a ton of pictures
<Intermezzo> oh, OK....very extensive
> so if he doesn't agree then Klasse wins
> cause that's the method I use for Klasse
<Intermezzo> But some others like Metallic Mike, might be open to it
<Intermezzo> I guess it would all depend on exactly how formal of an agreement you were looking for
> or we should all adopt my answer for Z or K?
> which is
> if you like to wax often use Z
> and if you don't use K
> (even if Z lasts 6 months)
<Intermezzo> Do you think that would be a good standard answer?
> that's what I don't get, if I get Z and it'll last 6 months then I won't be able to use it that way in which I use it only twice a year?
> Intermezzo, can I copy and paste this convo?
<Intermezzo> of course...
> I think that maybe if they can see our dialog then they they'll understand what I'm saying better.
<Intermezzo> while it's true that most Z users wax often, I just don't think that that is the determining fact when explaining the difference between Klasse and Zaino
<Intermezzo> sure.. no prob.
<Intermezzo> I meant determining factor...
<Intermezzo> let me ask you something..
> If I like Z then I'll be the one that says you can use this combo _________________ etc, etc and only use it twice a year
> but you guys have to let me get to that point and not give me examples of how fun it is to wax every month
> hence the test
> (shoot with the question)
> Intermezzo, I meant cut and paste our convo for posting on Autopia
<Intermezzo> Yeah, I guess that would be fine.
<Intermezzo> What would be your guess as to why Zaino users layer and layer and layer frequently, but Klasse users do a major detailing session twice a year?
> I have no answer for that question. I posted why I do it twice a year. (cause I only wax a prestine car, one that's been AIO'd, PPCL) Klasse is soo damn durable, I'm never going lock in any dirt as much as I can.
> it's the same reason why I only QD after a wash
> perhaps Zaino users layer and layer because it looks better every time
<Intermezzo> ok
> under my theory, I can only do that for a week, cause otherwise I wouldn't get to drive my car due to the fact that I don't like to wax a non-prepped car
> well I guess I could garage it until I get 20 coats of Z whatever, but that's not practical. for K I garage it for a week and work my way up 5 coats cause of the cure time
<Intermezzo> I see. Because you feel that driving it around, washing it, and then adding a coat of polymer would lock in contaminants?
> it has before
<Intermezzo> Did you try claying out the contaminant when you discovered it?
> my first Klasse job, I locked in rail rust, couldn't even feel it with your fingers anymore
> I was young an ignorant back then
<Intermezzo> hehe, I've done pretty bad stuff myself!
> well I had gotten soo tired of putting on all that Klasse, I skimped on the rail rust. I had realized the error of my ways
> but I wasn't going to strip
> so are we on the same page?
<Intermezzo> OK, so I'll ask a few of the Zaino users I talk to on occassion and see if they'll give you an 'informal' approval of your plan (with or without a few changes) to apply Zaino
<Intermezzo> yup, I follow you!
> then I can spend a weekend (and a few days) put the stuff on, and just carry on with just washing for 6 months
<Intermezzo> (cont) to apply Zaino on your car and compare it with Klasse
> yeah, applying it once
<Intermezzo> yeah, the plan I gave you allows for just two days of detailing...
> I just want experienced Z users to agree on an even comparison
> because let's say I just choose 1 coat of Z5 as the comparsion
> everyone will fret
> so give me your best
<Intermezzo> right right.. The only thing they are approving or agreeing on is the Zaino plan which would be a good comparison to what you've been doing with Klasse...
<Intermezzo> is that right?
> yes, thank you very much
<Intermezzo> ok....
> all this stems from, every time I ask why people keep adding Z, they answer because it's fun. yeah, I get it, but that does nothing for me
<Intermezzo> Well, part of the reason why I do it is for enjoyment, but Zaino, like Klasse, is very layerable...so there's an increase in shine and reflectivity with each coat....
<Intermezzo> granted, there are diminishing returns the higher you go though...
> Klasse hit's a limit IMO
> after the 5th coat it started to feel rubbery and smell like Klasse
<Intermezzo> I see.. hmmm
> that was under the best conditions
<Intermezzo> because when I see some of the pics over at the corvette forum.. Man, those guys are insane.. They regularly do 30, 40, 50, 100 coats a year..but their cars are just incredible...
> since I was layering every day in a closed environment
<Intermezzo> Some of the pics I see there put Autopian pics to shame....
<Intermezzo> YoSteve, I see what you are saying. That's interesting.. I heard David B had over ten coats once.. Maybe it wasnt under ideal conditions though
> we have no way of determining if 100 coats in 1 year = 100 coats on your car unless it was garaged the whole time
> 1 klasser has 20 coats of SG
> completely loves it
<Intermezzo> I'm sure there was some degradation of the older layers....But you know what I mean. To be technical, we can call it 100 applications...
> I have would like to put on 5 solid layers of Z but I need to know which combo would be best
<Intermezzo> well, on silver, it's not as critical. Especially with a swirl-free car like yours. I would say the best combo would be 3-4 coats of Z-5 followed by 1-2 coats of Z-2
> I wonder how much scrutiny will be involved if I don't like the combo you guys agree on
<Intermezzo> What kind of combo would you not like?
<Intermezzo> I mean....
<Intermezzo> there's a possibility you might not like our detailing schedule we suggest?
> no
> if it can be done in a garage in 4-5 days then i'm golden
<Intermezzo> Oh, that shouldn't be a problem
> that's what I would do for Klasse
<Intermezzo> ok, that sounds good
> cool
> postin now