Undercarriage detailing

4u2nvinmtl

4u2nvinmtl

New member
I'm looking to detail the undercarriage on my silver 09 Jeep SRT8 and I live in Montreal Canada where we have snow about 5 months out of the year and an unbelievable amount of salt gets laid down on the roads over the winters... I know rust is inevitable I'd just like to prolong it as much as possible without having to deal with rustproofing oozing out from the cracks after a regular maintenance wash.

As this is clearly going to be a lot of work that's basically only seen by my mechanic, I figured I'd just get a professional detailer to do it. I contacted a few places and they all said they don't do undercarriage because it's a lot of work and it requires lifting the car... Needless to say, I was surprised and disappointed no one was interested in detailing my undercarriage.

FYI: It's currently plastered with multiple layers of rustproofing oil's and grease and I have a good jack, ramps, stands and a pressure washer.

My question are:
  • Should I even bother cleaning the undercarriage (remove old rust proofing)?
  • What's the best way to remove multiple types/layers of rust proofing?
  • Do I need a lift or will jack stands/ramps be enough (the pressure washer gun is rather large with the attachment)?
  • Once the rust proofing is stripped/removed what should I use to protect from rust (I was thinking of using a rubberized coating)?
    • Fellow member MiVor had previously recommended Auto Armour & Fluid Film
    • Fellow member Striker had previously recommended LPS3 RUST INHIBITOR
    • I currently use Rust Check and was thinking about using a grease based rustproofing as the oil based ones get everywhere (comes creeping out of the door handles and rocker panels) all year long
  • Should I just clean the undercarriage yearly (in spring) to remove old rust proofing oil's and then just have the rustproofing reapplied in fall?
Undercarriage Protection thread containing the previous recommendations for rust proofing: http://www.autopia.org/forums/car-d...riage-protection.html?highlight=rust+proofing
 
Just to clarify, my truck was/is undercoated with AutoArmor. I believe it's the same (or similar) material that Ziebart and others use. Which is a typical thick, black petroleum based product (I don't know if it's rubberized or not). I plan to have the undercoating inspected and resprayed as/if necessary each spring after a thorough pressure wash 'n dry. I noticed a couple of spots (in wheel wells) that were missed that I later hit with some Rustoleum Rubberized Undercoating.
I can say that When I look at the truck, I can see the frame (and wheel wells) in spots and I like the look of the black coating that the undercoating provides.

For rustproofing, I have sprayed Fluid Film inside doors, rocker panels and tailgate. (I also use it on the door rollers and hinges). Fluid Film is lanolin based (wool grease) making it both a rust prevention as well as a lubricant. It remains somewhat fluid and flows/self levels to get into nooks and crannies of seams where moisture and rust likes to begin and grow.
Frankly, if I had it to do over, I might have done Fluid Film on the undercarriage as well. However, the AutoArmor is semi permanent (even if I never had it touched up) while the Fluid Film must be resprayed every year. But The AutoArmor is just a cover up, while the Fluid Film impregnates into the tiny spaces to better seal against moisture and rust.

I really don't consider undercoating and rustproofing as detailing - more like routine maintenance for protection against rust. I have read that the annual cost of rust in the US is estimated at $276 BILLION dollars!
http://www.brandfxbody.com/news-blo...n-the-united-states-estimated-at-276-billion/

Montreal and Central New York have similar weather so whatever you do for undercoating/rustproofing will aid in prolonging the life of your ride. Done properly and with minimal annual maintenance, a vehicle could/should last nearly forever. Drop in a new engine after 10-15 years and go for 30! LOL

NOTE LP3 Rust Inhibitor is NOT recommended for exterior use so should not be used for automotive undercoating/rustproofing. From their website:

LPS 3® Premier Rust Inhibitor is a specially formulated long-term corrosion
inhibitor protecting metal parts in inside storage for up to two years. When
applied it forms a soft, translucent, waxy film sealing out moisture, air,
acid, alkali fumes, and other corrosive elements.
 
4u2nvinmtl- I DO NOT recommend that you remove the existing undecoating. IMO you'd open a can of worms and more likely make things worse instead of better. I'd just work on cleaning away salt and dirt.

I don't follow you on the "only my mechanic would see it"...but then I keep a close eye on *all* areas/aspects of my vehicles, spotting developing issues long before my mechanics would (and before little issues turn into big problems). Heh heh, I wouldn't want to work on something dirty, so I don't ask mechanics to do that either ;)

EVERY WASH. That's how often I do the undercarriages, even the surface-rusted Tahoe.

OK...end of lecture :D

But seriously, I'd only clean the current undercoating off of surfaces where it doesn't need to be. I'd pressure wash everything somewhat gently to get the dirt off, then I'd probably use a solvent-based approach to clean the excess undercoating off places where you don't want it.

Then I'd keep it clean enough that you can spot stuff like little leaks or worn suspension bits.

DO NOT use rubberized undercoating! Once it gets compromised (and it will) it'll retain salty water in the "pockets" (where it's compromised) and make things worse instead of better. Stick with products that "creep" as opposed to those that "dry" (with the possible exception of Eastwood's Black Heavy Duty Anti-Rust for places that show, it dries like matte-black paint).
 
Accumulator said:
I don't follow you on the "only my mechanic would see it"...but then I keep a close eye on *all* areas/aspects of my vehicles, spotting developing issues long before my mechanics would (and before little issues turn into big problems). Heh heh, I wouldn't want to work on something dirty, so I don't ask mechanics to do that either ;)
Click to expand...

Ok correction me and my mechanic, LOL.

So, I'll just pressure rinse the undercarriage and APC/remove excessive rustproofing where it doesn't need to be like I did in the engine bay.

- Time to get wet
 
As someone that has cleaned several undercarriages for family cars, I'd suggest that you do not remove the factory undercoating, doing so could open a can of worms as said before. Your best bet is to simply jack up the car and be prepared to get yourself wet. I have found that the old bucket and brush technique works the best. One product that I've found to work is Purple Power Cleaner, just follow the directions and it does a pretty good job. A brush with a bristle quality between a paint brush and a tile brush is recommended, something with oomph, but not too much oomph. For areas where you have rust, if you do, go from the middle of the rust spot and add 1 inch radius to it, and that's the area that you need to fully restore rust protection. In the old jeep world, I used to have an '89 Wrangler, POR 15 worked great for undercoating, but your best bet is to OEM for little spots, that way you don't run into chemicals not playing well together. Since you are part of the rust belt, make sure that you at least rinse the undercarriage once a month in the winter, then do a deep clean in the summer. That regimen should keep you pretty well off. One thing that I've noticed since living in Northern Illinois and moving to Texas is that there are few auto- car washes that have an undercarriage cleaning option by themselves, in Illinois you could pull into an auto CW and just get the undercarriage cleaned. Hope this helps!

P.S.- Please don't remove the excess as you could start a cascading effect of failure, taking off that little too much is all it takes. I know excess looks unsightly to some, but are we really being judged on how the undercoating of our DD's look?
 
TheMeanGreen- I do agree with you that somebody could open a can of worms by removing what's there...but I've had lots of undercoating on things that simply don't need it (plastics?!?). Heh heh, I guess I *am* awfully judgemental about how my undercarriages look :o But "better safe than sorry!", huh?

You're right about using good brushes! I like ones with natural bristles as they come clean a lot easier for me.

FWIW, adn I guess it's a whole 'nother topic, I've quit using POR15 in favor of different Paint Over Rust products. Seems like they've made some significant advances in that field over last few years and I'm finding some of the alternatives more, uhm...Accumulator-proof.
 
Accumulator said:
DO NOT use rubberized undercoating! Once it gets compromised (and it will) it'll retain salty water in the "pockets" (where it's compromised) and make things worse instead of better. Stick with products that "creep" as opposed to those that "dry" (with the possible exception of Eastwood's Black Heavy Duty Anti-Rust for places that show, it dries like matte-black paint).
Click to expand...

I don't see the problem. Rubberized products like Flex Seal, Plasti Dip, and Rustoleum Rubberized Undercoating (to name a few) have good track records - at lease as good as any.
 
MiVor-I won't argue it, but I really do think the chances of it retaining salt/etc. are too great so I'm gonna chime in with my 2¢ whenever the subject comes up :D

Also when it comes to track records in the sense of objectively researched performance in the field, AFAIK there are very few products with much real data behind them.

Oh how I wish Ron Ketcham were posting! He knew volumes on this subject, gleened from many years of working with FinishKare, ValuGard, and the major automakers. He sent me some of the ValuGard undercoating that they made for DaimlerChrysler and that stuff had a lot of testing behind it. Did require a proper sprayer though (which I had).
 
I inspected the undercarriage in detail yesterday and found something different... The frame is not rusting at all and painted black then coated with like 5+ years of rustproofing and grime. The panels (flat metal surfaces beneath) are painted matte army green (never seen this before) and also don't have rust, the exhaust is fairly new and is polished stainless so it looks great (no rust), the oil pan and transmission pan are both aluminum so they are a little oxidized but look fine. As 90% of my suspension components have been replaced they are immaculate. The rear axle was in the roughest shape with an incredible amount of dirt/mud caked on (like 1-2 inches deep). Seeing so much dirt I'm thinking this is going to be a real mess to clean (clearly never cleaned).

I'm still concerned that the dirt & salt would mix with the rust proofing and make something new and IMHO it has (it's the new ultimate compound with some rust protection). I'm still really strongly considering removing all the rustproofing (APC + pressure washer + lots of wiping) but not stripping any factory coating / paint. If I go this route I'd schedule a rustproofing application the following day to make sure the areas I expose are re-protected. Something makes me think that with all these layers of grim the new layers of rust proofing just won’t be able to penetrate/permeate the grime to provide any benefit/protection and just cause more grime to adhere.

Hopefully, the weather is good this weekend and I can clean it all up and post a detailed write-up with pictures (before and after). I was hoping I could use a LSP to protect (like a coating), LOL. I'm also debating applying the rustproofing myself so it's done with more accuracy (the rust proofing shops around here basically spray and pray).
 
If you can remove any undercoating with APC and pressure washing, it needs to come off anyway* and resprayed with something that will stick to the metal! As for the dirt and grime, yeah it should come off.

* Loose undercoating that is not bonded to the vehicle metal will just let (and trap) moisture and cause rust to 'grow' unchecked. In some ways this is worse than if there was no undercoating at all!
 
4u2nvinmtl- That sounds about as I'd expect. Yeah, clean it up good and then see where you stand. Some of those surfaces would, IMO look *great* all cleaned up.

MiVor- Regarding our earlier posts on this thread, I was thinking that I think you and I are basically on the same page when it comes to this topic. Your preventative measures on your truck were first-rate IMO.
 
Accumulator said:
MiVor- Regarding our earlier posts on this thread, I was thinking that I think you and I are basically on the same page when it comes to this topic. Your preventative measures on your truck were first-rate IMO.
Click to expand...

Thank-you for the thumbs up...you gotta take care of yer toys iffin yer gonna keepem. <g>
 

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MiVor- An interesting comparison would be to take the Fluid Film, and others like KBS Cavity Coater and Eastwood's Internal Frame Coating, and see what the diffs and similarities are. I've used both the latter products but never tried the Fluid Film. Bet there are plenty of other such products too.
 
House of Wax said:
Sub'n to this thread as I'm looking to pick up a fox body mustang soon

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Nice
You going to drag it autox or cruiser?

Think its wolfs performance? That fixes all the short commings with the rear tri 4 link
otherwise theres 2 companies last i checked that offers a torque arm/3 link...cant remember which hah
 
With POR15 coming up so often in threads like this, I'd like for somebody (besides Yours Truly) to compare some of the various Paint Over Rust products currently available...I certainly have my (rather strong!) opinions/preferences, but I'm curious what others would think if they tried a few different products. I find I can't even boil it down farther than three (five or six if you count products that aren't really "paint") different ones for different applications.
 
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