Swirl removal Q with PC, #80 and Sonus pads

Y

YorkshireLass

New member
Hi there guys and gals:)



Well, after lurking around this forum for a year or so and doing all my polishing by hand, I have just become yet another proud UK owner of the Porter Cable. I bought the polisher kit that includes the Sonus DAS pads (orange, green, blue) and mf bonnets, which I have already decided will be used over the white PC pad - no way will they fit over the orange pad!!



So, I would just like to run my plan of attack by you for any comments or opinions, esp regarding the pad / polish combo I'm going to use.



I have been fortunate enough to be able to practice with the PC on an old wing off my car (removed following an accident) which I kept for just this kind of situation, so I am fairly sure that it represents the state of my car as a whole.



I thought I just had mild swirls, so started off with the green pad and #80 speed glaze, which actually didn't do that much, so I stepped up to #80 on the orange pad. Bearing in mind I was learning how to drive the PC at the time, it took a good two 'go's' with the orange pad to remove the majority of the swirls. But there was still some marring left (now whether this was from the #80 - although I did work that well - or was just the remnants of the marring that I started with, I don't really know), so I went back to the green pad with #80 which finished off the job great. So, I guess my swirls were not as minor as I thought!



So, to summarise, the question is does it seem reasonable to you to be going over the car with orange & #80 and then green & #80?



This may seem a simple Q, but I've done a lot of reading and people seem to always use different products with diferent grades of pads. My reasoning is that #80 breaks down so well it's reasonable to assume that the difference in pads can make all the difference when it comes to getting the final prepped surface.



Also for information, I worked the #80 in with both pads at speed 2, increasing to about 5, with light pressure (trying to master the apply pressure until it bogs, then lift off a little theory), until it was definately clear. I was working a section of about 1.5 sq feet.



So does this sound OK by you guys?



I haven't decided what I will top with yet - I usually use just #26 paste (which I still intend to do by hand, it's so easy), but I'm considering maybe nxt or gold class liquid with the blue pad, both of which I have already, or #7 (tho there may not be much benefit from this), before the #26. My paint is 1992 mazda miata black - mostly single stage, but about 1/3 repainted & clearcoated sadly...:(



Apologies for the length of the post, just trying to give you all the info you might need!



Thanks for any help,



Charlotte
 
Hi york,



Well as far as it being ok to go with #80 with a different pads, I guess it would be fine. As most people say, "use the least aggressive" product and pad first. So being that you did the green pad first, I would think you did that, then needed more to get rid of them. I would say that you did the right thing with doing what you did.



But with my expereience with #80, I would say that your swirls were a little more than minor. I recently did my Uncle's Caddy with #80/EX combo. I used #80 with a Meguiar's polishing pad and was able to get most of the swirls out. You may have also wanted to remove more of the swirls than I was worried about, so maybe our expereince was different. Here is a before and after of #80 w/polishing pad and PC on 6 giving it simliar pressure as you were describing!



Here is the link to my Uncle's Caddy!



17155caddy1.jpg




17155caddy2.jpg
 
I like to blitz the paint with the abrasives at 5.5, and then once they have broken down step down to 3.5-4 to work the oils in and restore gloss back to the paint.



You're good to go with an LSP from there.



I love #7s depth and gloss and I think it is worth trying. You'll see what kind of finish your paint is capable of. Just don't get it on plastic or rubber!!!

You will need a cleaner-free LSP to follow, a carnauba would be great...



Also, for swirls that aren't being removed by the #80/orange combo, try DACP/orange. It is not THAT much more abrasive than #80 (6 to 4 on Megs scale).



I too use the SONUS kit and the bonnets DO fit over the orange. Just put them on AFTER you've attached the pad to the backing plate. I really don't have that much use for them though. I like applying/removing LSPs by hand, but I have used them as a final buff after polishing with #7. It makes the 'finicky' removal of #7 easier (it's not THAT bad, Autopians are just babied by easy to remove products, no offense guys!!!)
 
04Cobra is that paint on the softer side ?



I would find trying to remove those swirl marks on a BMW for example would take at least the Sonus Orange pad and DACP, and probably two or three passes, adding pressure to the PC as I went. I tend to find swirl removal best with Menzerna IP, and either Green pad first, if that doesn't touch, then I up the pad to Orange, that usually does the trick, although it still might take 2 or 3 passes of an area.



I think you do the right thing to practice on a wing if you have one, and it does take quite a bit of practice to remove swirls I find. One needs to become familiar with the pads aggressiveness, the products break down stages, when to apply more pressure when to apply none etc. Its great when those danged things are removed though :)
 
Thanks guys:)



I guess by the time I've been around the car once or twice I should have the technique more under control. It certainly was lovely to see my paint with NO swirls for the first time ever... even if it was 'just' on my practice panel. :cool:



So, I guess there's nothing wierd about using the #80 with both orange and green pads. Must just be me. :nixweiss

If I had DACP already I'd give it a whirl, but I'm reluctant to buy more products if #80 will do it (which it seems it will, eventually). No way I could have achived this by hand, without my arm falling off.



I too had thought to use the mf bonnet for removal of #7 - I've used #7 by hand, and didn't find it too bad at all.



I'll have plenty of time to practice before I hit my car, as she has to go back to the dealership for them to fix the NEW wing (paint peeling off after just 3 months...:mad: ). So, I'll wait for them to finish inflicting their own special brand of scuffs and scratches, and then go with whatever programme I have figured out. I can't wait! Thanks again for your reassurance and advice.



Charlotte
 
i should be getting my #83 and #80 soon, cant wait to get started on the car, YorkshireLass were do you buy your products from ?
 
I tend to buy all the 'interesting' stuff online from meguires UK - we do have a megs stockist in Harrogate, who are supposed to carry something like 85% of their stock, but what do you know, they only stock the things I don't really want!

I notice Alex at www.seriousperformance.co.uk (I think that's the correct address) carries various other interesting stock, including stuff from Clearkote, P21S and Poorboys, but I haven't bought from him (yet).



Have just given my car a thorough washing - but no getting the PC out yet - I still need to wait til I can clay, get some tape etc... Ah, patience! Roll on Spring!



Charlotte:)
 
I never use anybody else apart from Alex, great guy and service to match!



Alex also stocks the 'Pro' range of Meguiars as available on their website, but delivery from SP is somewhat quicker :xyxthumbs
 
Yup, don't have any reservations re SP, just a shortage of the ole folding stuff! Me = poor postgrad student:sosad



About due for some clay tho' :hm
 
Clay, once you have used it you will wonder how you ever lived without it.



Oh yes, I will also vote for Alex being a good guy to buy from.



As for that money stuff, detailing need not be very expensive and it looks as if you have spent some money in the best way by buying a PC
 
I used clay for the first time last summer, and yes, I was amazed at the difference. Actually I made my BF try it out on the back of his guitar first, as I was scared!:o



I used the megs clay, but found it a little dried out around the edges (new), and quite hard to warm up enough to use - although I did fine eventually, so I think I'll give SPs clay a go this time.



Also, I have to confess that the PC is a very early birthday present from my parents - I took it over to their house last night, and gave them a demo, with one of the mf bonnets over the white PC pad and some furniture wax!:xyxthumbs Their coffee tables have never glowed so well!
 
Hey, no worries - advice is what I'm here for:)





Back OT, I just read this reply from Accumulator, on another thread, regarding the use of #80 and LC orange pads - I hope he won't mind me posting it here for the benefit of others reading this thread...



"The orange pad might leave some micromarring....hm..#80 seems to be best matched with regular polishing pads since it is designed to leave a ready-to-wax finish. I just don't like to use #80 with aggressive pads."





If I read this correctly, then it seems my process of using #80 (given that I don't have DACP, for example) with orange and green pads successively does make some sense - just corroborating the advice given previously really! ;)



Charlotte
 
dpeezy415 said:
I love #7s depth and gloss and I think it is worth trying. You'll see what kind of finish your paint is capable of. Just don't get it on plastic or rubber!!!

You will need a cleaner-free LSP to follow, a carnauba would be great...



Also, for swirls that aren't being removed by the #80/orange combo, try DACP/orange. It is not THAT much more abrasive than #80 (6 to 4 on Megs scale).
Click to expand...



just got my pc and sonus das, havent used yet...



what pad do you apply #7 with? green or blue?



can i go dacp/orange to #7/green or will there be micromarring to deal with and clean up first....



thankx
 
YorkshireLass- Nah, I don't mind my posts being excerpted from as long as people don't take things out of context.



IMO the LC orange pad is as aggressive as is suitable for #80. Even that is overkill once the #80 starts breaking down, but it will let you accomplish things that might be tougher with a milder pad. So using it first, then #80 again with a milder pad should work fine.



Heh heh, I gotta get up-to-date on all the different pads out there :o



kidzey- You should generally expect micromarring from the DACP/#83 no matter what pad you use. That's just IMO, but as I see it, DACP is sorta tricky for most people to use *exactly* right. Even Mike Phillips (of Meguiar's) says he's more likely to get a ready-to-wax finish with DACP if he uses a rotary instead of the PC. Just a matter of how it breaks down.



So I'd always plan to follow DACP with a milder, yet still abrasive product. Some people use #82/#9, but I'd use #80, I just find it more user friendly.



Since I don't know from green/blue pads (sheesh, gotta look into this...) I'll just say that there's no point in using a pad with any "cut" since the #7 is nonabrasive. But as long as the pads in question are both too soft to cause micromarring (and I believe that's the case) then I'd use the one with the most "open" foam since #7 is a sorta-viscous product that doesn't really "dry" in the conventional sense. IMO the more open pad would be less likely to load up/cake with a product like that. IMO we can get a bit extreme about the whole type-of-pad thing, especially when discussing the use of nonabrasive products.



But just FWIW, I don't use #7 on anything except single stage these days. On b/c I'd probably use #3/#5/#81 instead if I used such a Meg's product at all (which I don't ;) ). Actually, when I run out of #7 I'll probably use something else even on ss. Probably #5 because it's *SO* user-friendly. Not as oily/wet as #7 though.
 
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