Scholl Concepts...S20, S40, Spider pads?

BudgetPlan1

BudgetPlan1

Active member
Finding these products kinda interesting lately (hey, it`s cheaper than messing around with coatings) and don`t see too much about `em.

Anyone have any experience with S20 or S40?

Already have some S40 with their honey spider pads (haven`t used yet), figure ultra-fine polish aka Menz 3800 and ordered some S20 w/ Blue & Purple spider pads, figr`d in the same medium class as maybe Menz 2400.

Curious as to any experiences with the Scholls line. Appears that it likes closed-cell pads so I can always use LC HydroTechs as well I`d guess. Man, those Scholls spider pads are a bit pricey...

Have a black Honda Accord Coupe w/ month old 22ple HPC on it that I`n gonna remove, wanted to try the Scholls stuff on it. Anybody got any suggestions, Scholls-wise?

Any suggestions/experiences appreciated before I wade on in and get myself into another fine mess?
 
I have some experience with S20 Black. Generally use them with the Blue spider pads for a one step.
I find little product goes a long way. When I first started using it I went a bit heavy and too fast on the machine and got a ton of dusting. The CP forum gave me some advice to try:
3-4 pea size drops to prime the pad to start. 3-4 after. Also keep the machine speed around 4 - 4.5 if you can, maybe even start with 3.5 first.

You could definitely try the S20 with the Honey spider pads first and then with the Blue to see if there is a difference in cut/ finish. I have both pads as well and on softer paints you can get pretty good cut with the Honey pads and it finishes out great. You may get marring with the purple pads on softer paint.

I agree the pads are pretty steep but so far they have been really good quality. I do mostly one-step corrections and blue pads are usually the ones I reach for first. Which reminds me I need to pick up some 3inch blue pads.

I really just follow the instructions from Car Pro to start.(below) then adjust accordingly based on temp/ paint type.

[FONT=&quot]Application:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
  1. For best results use Scholl Concepts white Spider Pad or Navy blue Spider pad.
  2. After spreading across 2-2.5 Ft area on low speed, work at speed 4-5 applying moderate pressure through the first half of the cycle.
  3. Next use progressively lighter pressure until finished down. Machine speed varies based on machine and paint.
  4. Once completed, buff off the faint residue using our Yellow Fellow microfiber towel.
  5. Clean pad
  6. Use only 3-5 pea size drops for each additional section (depending on pad size), repeating steps 2-5 after each section.


[/FONT]
 
RaydiantDetail said:
You could definitely try the S20 with the Honey spider pads first and then with the Blue to see if there is a difference in cut/ finish. I have both pads as well and on softer paints you can get pretty good cut with the Honey pads and it finishes out great. You may get marring with the purple pads on softer paint.
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Interesting...will give the honeys a shot first. I thought the blue was more aggressive than the purple, so i figr`d purple first to see how that does. Didn`t think the honey would have much effect but will try first. Guess I`ll find out how `persistent` 22ple HPC is...
 
Ohhhhh sorry I missed the part about using it to remove the coating!
I have no idea if the honey with the s20 would but you could give it a shot. I have never used/ removed 22ple HPC.
And you are correct the purple has slightly less cut than the blue. I think I meant the white pad lol
 
RaydiantDetail said:
Ohhhhh sorry I missed the part about using it to remove the coating!
I have no idea if the honey with the s20 would but you could give it a shot. I have never used/ removed 22ple HPC.
And you are correct the purple has slightly less cut than the blue. I think I meant the white pad lol
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Worse comes to worse with regard to cutting, have some LC Hydrotechs to try with it too. I guess Scholls likes closed cell pads. Wonder how a Scholl spider pad will hold up with a Flex 3401? I guess I`ll find out and if it shreds `em, out comes the Rupes. Seem to prefer the Flex for the more aggressive steps...
 
Do you have CPs MF pad ? I really like them, solid pads.
I have used S20 /Blue spider on my Chevy Malibu`s black paint, was a med. cut.
Had to use the smallest amount, and it worked well. I`d say very close to Rupes Green/pads.
A polish not a compound.

The S40 I`ve used with Rupes white pads, and brought my paint to a stunning level of gloss !
Much easier to work with then the Rupes Diamond polish.
Going to try The Honey spider w/ S40 next. Wish they had a 3" honey spider pad.
Good Luck
;)
 
Out of curiosity BudgetPlan1... why would you want to remove the coating applied one month ago?


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Consistency and looks. Been a long road finding the combo I liked and worked best for my situation (Kamikaze Miyani + ISM + Infinity Wax + Overcoat). 2 outta 3 cars are done now, this is last one. I was gonna go with the 22ple HPC on the new, non-metallic black 2017 Honda Accord V6 coupe (picked up around beginning of July) so I quickly applied the 22ple HPC (which was my 2nd favorite coating after last winters auditions) upon getting the car.

Was kinda waffling on whether to stick it out with the 22ple HPC, looks really good, very self cleaning, a *very*, *very* good product...but after I recently finished the non-metallic black Vette with the Kami combo and saw them both parked next to each other in the garage, the Kami combo has a deep, lustrous, rich look to it that the harder, sharper, high gloss look of the 22ple can`t match, for my tastes anyway. The ISM also darkens the finish a bit, I initially thought it would be no big deal, but side by side the 22ple looks `a foot deep` while the Kami on the Vette looks a MILE deep

Also, while the 22ple that I applied to a fleet vehicle last March still looks amazing with little to no maintenance as do some other vehicles I`ve used it on last Spring, I *know* without a doubt that the Kamikaze stuff will make it thru the NE Ohio winter without blinking (have had on one of our daily drivers since October 2016).

So, after all the above babbling, for my tastes and preferences, the Kamikaze stuff on black just looks better to me and I know it will protect. If I had a white car, perhaps the hard, ultra-gloss of the 22ple might be preferable (I used it on my godson`s white Honda and it made the almost pearlescent white really, REALLY pop) but for darker colors the Kamikaze stuff is on another level, again, to my eyes/preferences. I initially though that on a non-metallic black that the hard gloss of the 22ple would be really cool, and it is; however, the Kamikaze just adds something `intangibly mesmerizing` besides outright gloss...it just looks luxurious.

Hopefully I`m done wandering the coating wilderness now...although I gotta say that 512Detail`s threads about Polish Angel Cosmic really have my credit card trembling.

And, yep...I probably got a little obsessed about this coating stuff.

BadgerRivFan said:
Out of curiosity BudgetPlan1... why would you want to remove the coating applied one month ago?


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Click to expand...
 
^^^ That ^^^ is a very detailed (no pun intended) and complete response. Thank you! I have the Miyabi/ISM combo still sitting in the boxes (no infinity wax, but do use overcoat) waiting to go on my wife`s "midnight amethyst" (rich purple metallic) paint. I have PA Cosmic V2 on both my black `70 Riv show car (non-metallic) and navy blue `01 vette, and it looks great. Probably closer to the look of HPC then the kamikaze products as you describe them though. I really appreciate your descriptive impressions of the products you use...

Now, since I have thoroughly hijacked your thread I hope others can chime in regarding your Scholl`s products inquiry
 
The Infinity Wax is definately in the `not necessary` class...what it adds (besides additional protection, hopefully) is very, very subtle...but I like it.

Small review: https://www.autopia.org/forums/detailing-product-reviews/187802-kamikaze-infinity-wax.html

BadgerRivFan said:
^^^ That ^^^ is a very detailed (no pun intended) and complete response. Thank you! I have the Miyabi/ISM combo still sitting in the boxes (no infinity wax, but do use overcoat) waiting to go on my wife`s "midnight amethyst" (rich purple metallic) paint. I have PA Cosmic V2 on both my black `70 Riv show car (non-metallic) and navy blue `01 vette, and it looks great. Probably closer to the look of HPC then the kamikaze products as you describe them though. I really appreciate your descriptive impressions of the products you use...

Now, since I have thoroughly hijacked your thread I hope others can chime in regarding your Scholl`s products inquiry
Click to expand...
 
If you have hard paint. Any of those combos will remove HPC without much difference. Softer paint, honey pad and either S20 or S40. I`ve always liked the Scholl`s stuff.

Regarding 22PLE range, I`ve found HPC better for light / metallic paints. VXPro2 is more closer to ISM in looks but not worth it to buy as you already have your chosen coating weapons. VXPro2 is also more $ than HPC.
 
I haven`t tried S40, but S20 is the best polish I own by a LONG shot. S30+ is what I use as a finishing polish on extremely soft sticky paints and it finishes perfect 100% of the time in my experience. In my experience S30+, S20 Black, and S3 Gold XXL are so far ahead of everything else it`s worth spending the money. Boss creams and HD Polish+ are certainly close, but once you master using Scholl`s polishes you`ll see why they are so special. RaydiantDetail gave very good advice but I actually use even less than he suggested. I use 3 tiny pea sized drops on an unprimed pad for my first section pass. I then blow as much spent polish and paint out of my pad with compressed air and apply 2-3 even smaller drops from there on out. The lubricants in Scholl Concepts polishes do not dry up on soft porous paints and even when overworked, it`s removal is still a breeze.
 
mg031 said:
If you have hard paint. Any of those combos will remove HPC without much difference. Softer paint, honey pad and either S20 or S40. I`ve always liked the Scholl`s stuff.

Regarding 22PLE range, I`ve found HPC better for light / metallic paints. VXPro2 is more closer to ISM in looks but not worth it to buy as you already have your chosen coating weapons. VXPro2 is also more $ than HPC.
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Thank you...very good to know. It`s a black Honda so not a hard paint if our other Honda is any indication. Likely give the S20 Black w honey spider pad a try first and see how it goes.

I really liked the 22ple stuff. Great to work with, fantastic gloss. It very nearly became the top pick. Generally avaliable but I have seen out of stock a few times for a week or two. Was really looking forward to the Finitura product, whenever it`s finally released.

The 24hrs between coats was kinda inconvenient though...not a deal killer but logistically challenging as far as convenience goes. I see they`re testing a new, two part coating, likely pro only.
LashingStanley said:
I haven`t tried S40, but S20 is the best polish I own by a LONG shot. S30+ is what I use as a finishing polish on extremely soft sticky paints and it finishes perfect 100% of the time in my experience. In my experience S30+, S20 Black, and S3 Gold XXL are so far ahead of everything else it`s worth spending the money. Boss creams and HD Polish+ are certainly close, but once you master using Scholl`s polishes you`ll see why they are so special. RaydiantDetail gave very good advice but I actually use even less than he suggested. I use 3 tiny pea sized drops on an unprimed pad for my first section pass. I then blow as much spent polish and paint out of my pad with compressed air and apply 2-3 even smaller drops from there on out. The lubricants in Scholl Concepts polishes do not dry up on soft porous paints and even when overworked, it`s removal is still a breeze.
Click to expand...
Will heed your advice, thank you. I tried a bit of HD Polish+ on the Vette when I was getting that ready to coat. Didn`t have much cut on the hard GM paint but it sure was nice to use. It`s SMAT, correct?

Will be nice to be done with this...for a while anyway.

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Well, I *think* the S20 with the honey spider pad took care of the 22ple HPC.

Foamed with Gyeon Foam at 1:3 using new MTM Hydro M22 cannon (pricey, but a nice piece; better than my Amazon/Duschin ones), clayed with Nanoskin Fine mitt (not really sure why), 4 passes (2 medium pressure, 2 light) with Scholl S20 on honey spider pad, Flex 3401 on speed 4.5, wipedown with Gyeon Prep.

Looking closely in person can see difference (And feel it) between polished section and 22ple HPC areas so that`s helpful.

Little bit disappointed the 22ple is coming off so easily...hmmmm.

https://youtu.be/ZgpDKfwLG2U

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BudgetPlan1 said:
Well, I *think* the S20 with the honey spider pad took care of the 22ple HPC.

Foamed with Gyeon Foam at 1:3 using new MTM Hydro M22 cannon (pricey, but a nice piece; better than my Amazon/Duschin ones), clayed with Nanoskin Fine mitt (not really sure why), 4 passes (2 medium pressure, 2 light) with Scholl S20 on honey spider pad, Flex 3401 on speed 4.5, wipedown with Gyeon Prep.

Looking closely in person can see difference (And feel it) between polished section and 22ple HPC areas so that`s helpful.

Little bit disappointed the 22ple is coming off so easily...hmmmm.

https://youtu.be/ZgpDKfwLG2U

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Click to expand...

So you are polishing off a coating with a super soft pad and a med. polish ? WOW !

That is amazing.
When I try to polish off my sealant and waxes, it always takes at least a MF pad and compound :blink:
 
Mary B said:
So you are polishing off a coating with a super soft pad and a med. polish ? WOW !

That is amazing.
When I try to polish off my sealant and waxes, it always takes at least a MF pad and compound :blink:
Click to expand...
I polished off WG Uber Ceramic with M205 and an orange LC pad a couple of months ago.

That said, the Scholls S20 w the spider pads is pretty impressive...i can only imagine the cut using one of the navy blue spider pads. Works quick too. Came off nice and clean as well. Finished pretty much LSP ready but ya know how that goes.

Was a little less impressed with the S40 although it`s still a great product; finishes great. Just so oily to wipe off; needs prep spray to really remove the haze left by the polish carrier fluid, whatever that may be.

For both, very, very little product required and it takes a little time to determine best method/quantities to use given machine, paint and polishing `style` differences. But it sure gives nice results.

On aspect of Scholl that is `nearly` unforgivable is their packaging. I would be hard pressed to design a bottle that would be worse for applying small drops of liquids to pads. It`s truly absurd.

I was looking for something that I could use in place of Menzerna 2400 (or whatever it`s called this week) and ran across some references to Scholls and its quicker DAT technology (or marketing). Figrd I`d need at least the purple spider but figrd I give the honey first (as was suggested above). And it worked great with the Flex; I was pretty surprised.

`They` say the spider pads cut better than equivalent flats and I`m inclined to believe it until I get a chance to use them with a more familiar product/liquid and see the results.

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BudgetPlan1 said:
I polished off WG Uber Ceramic with M205 and an orange LC pad a couple of months ago.

That said, the Scholls S20 w the spider pads is pretty impressive...i can only imagine the cut using one of the navy blue spider pads. Works quick too. Came off nice and clean as well. Finished pretty much LSP ready but ya know how that goes.

Was a little less impressed with the S40 although it`s still a great product; finishes great. Just so oily to wipe off; needs prep spray to really remove the haze left by the polish carrier fluid, whatever that may be.

For both, very, very little product required and it takes a little time to determine best method/quantities to use given machine, paint and polishing `style` differences. But it sure gives nice results.

On aspect of Scholl that is `nearly` unforgivable is their packaging. I would be hard pressed to design a bottle that would be worse for applying small drops of liquids to pads. It`s truly absurd.

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Sonax Perfect Finish bottle is horrible for that as well. I actually transferred my s20 to a smaller megs squeeze dispenser bottle and use that. Much easier to squeeze a small amount.

Glad the s20 with the spider pad is working well for you and it`s removing the coating as well! That`s pretty great. I know some coatings generally require heavy compounding or sanding to remove.

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RaydiantDetail said:
Sonax Perfect Finish bottle is horrible for that as well. I actually transferred my s20 to a smaller megs squeeze dispenser bottle and use that. Much easier to squeeze a small amount.
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Yeah, it quickly went into an old D300 bottle I kept. Just amazing how nobody at Scholl said "Wow, this sucks..." when they finalized container selection.

RaydiantDetail said:
know some coatings generally require heavy compounding or sanding to remove.

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I have heard Crystal Serum needs sanding; what other coatings have you run into that require some pretty aggressive attention?

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BudgetPlan1 said:
Yeah, it quickly went into an old D300 bottle I kept. Just amazing how nobody at Scholl said "Wow, this sucks..." when they finalized container selection selection.
Click to expand...

lol, I couldn`t agree more. For as much work, thought, and engineering that went inside the bottle, their bottles and method of dispensing the product is the worst I`ve seen. Of all the different compounds and polishes on the market where less product generally produces better results, it`s probably the most important aspect of effectively using any of the Scholl abrasives. Yet the dispenser makes that virtually impossible. I`m shocked they haven`t changed it yet.

I adore S30+, S20, & S3 Gold but all three of them are immediately transferred into 8oz self cleaning bottles. If I was scholl`s, I would seriously fire whoever screwed the pooch on that. They should also fire the guy in charge of marketing as well.
 
Well, finally getting to it, the last if our personal cars. Today, the S20 with the honey spider and the S40 with Hydrotech Crimson is working quite nicely, better than S40 with the honey spider. Using Flex 3401 for both and working S40 for 6 passes, very, very `Not even machine weight` pressure on final 3 S40 passes.

No dust, not much residue...nice. I dunno...
0b02bb2c334706b970932202f5ae3b77.jpg


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