Opinions from pros - what would you do if this were your car?

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imported_Picus

New member
Hey guys; long time no post. I hope you're all well. :)



So, an opinion to ask from some of the pros, I'm kind of on the fence on this one. A few years ago I worked on this car: '67 Stingray ; at the time the paint was thin, but not in a hugely worrisome manner except for a few spots. There was very minor paint cracking on the hood near some of the edges. At the time I was getting readings in the ~100 micrometers, slightly less on the hood and roof.



Fast forward to this year; over the winter something got on the paint (owner isn't sure what), and it put etchings on the horizontal panels; small ones, like 1mm dots. The car felt rough and claybar'ing removed a *ton* of white/grey something...felt like concrete dust or something. A few test spots to remove the etchings basically revealed that to remove them entirely would be impossible without compromising the paint.



So, if it's your car, do you leave it alone? Continue to sand and compound (and further damage the paint)? Lightly polish to restore some of the gloss, but ignore the etchings? Re-spray? vinyl color wrap? I have an opinion on what I would probably do, but I thought I'd ask you guys to hear some differing opinions.
 
Definitely long time no see, Picus!



Personally, I would start getting prepared to spring for a complete respray. If the customer is headstrong about the original paint on the car then I wouldn't touch it and deal with the condition the paint is currently. But as you've said, the paint is already becoming compromised in certain areas of the car so the time for temporary correction is done. Repaint it or leave it is my vote.
 
Picus said:
The car felt rough and claybar'ing removed a *ton* of white/grey something...felt like concrete dust or something. A few test spots to remove the etchings basically revealed that to remove them entirely would be impossible without compromising the paint.
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I'd use 4000 Micro-Surface sandpaper to remove it. That stuff is very safe on thin paint and will remove contaminants very effectively and efficiently. You'll only need a finishing polish to remove its marring.
 
Well if it were my car and a repaint was in my budget that would be the path I'd take hands down. That way I could also address the cracking issues at the same time and apply enough material to sand it smooth as glass and have plenty left for later corrections.



On the other hand, if this car has the original finish and preserving it means a lot to the owner then I would just make it the best I can without pushing it too far.



Rasky
 
David Fermani said:
I'd use 4000 Micro-Surface sandpaper to remove it. That stuff is very safe on thin paint and will remove contaminants very effectively and efficiently. You'll only need a finishing polish to remove its marring.
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I would give this a try, excellent idea. I've used this stuff and was amazed. If that fails which I don't suspect it will........got with scotts plan.



Cheers,

Greg



ps. welcome back......
 
Thanks to those that have replied. :) I expected a variety of opinions!



Todd - I don't think he wants to re-spray as a last resort. It is definitely an option, though.



David - I actually have some 4 and 5k grit, though not Micro-Surface. I did try some 5k and then polished with M105 on a black finishing pad, then 205 on a black finishing pad; finished nice and clean but the etchings were still present. Minimized, but present. I'm talking to the owner about getting slightly more aggressive, but to be completely honest, I am hesitant...the paint is to the point that I think any real removal (which would remove the etchings) might make it worse. I hear you, though; maybe I'll try 4k.



Rasky & Scott - that's sort of the way I was leaning. Something like 205 to remove the bulk of the marring, glaze it, and enjoy it for as long as possible.



What do you guys think about the vinyl idea? I've seen a few cars wrapped with painted vinyl and it is very, very convincing; the nice thing is it'd save the current paint too (to what end, I don't know...but it would. :D).



Edit; Greg (and David); I will try some 4k in an inconspicuous spot and see how it goes. Is the Micro-surface stuff a lot different than the Mirka-Abralon stuff? That's what I have in 4k.
 
Never seen a vinyl wrap up close yet so it's hard to say. It would seem weird to do it to such a beautiful car though. I'd expect to see it on Honda's and other imports long before I'd see it on a classic. :D
 
I know what you mean, but it's come a long way ime. I've seen it on some exotics; if done correctly it's virtually undetectable; it's painted vinyl so you treat it just like regular paint. I just thought it might be an option if the owner was serious about avoiding a respray. FLX-Paint Gallery Page
 
What is the owners concern about getting the car resprayed? The original paint, cost, or quality?



Call me a heathen, but I just never got the "original paint!!" mind-set. Personally, I'd much rather see a good looking paint job than a marred and swirled original paint. I can respect the values held from that point of view, but it's just not mine.
 
todd@bsaw said:
What is the owners concern about getting the car resprayed? The original paint, cost, or quality?



Call me a heathen, but I just never got the "original paint!!" mind-set. Personally, I'd much rather see a good looking paint job than a marred and swirled original paint. I can respect the values held from that point of view, but it's just not mine.
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I agree. To me a classic car such is this should be worth more correctly restored vs. one with a so so finish that's original.
 
todd@bsaw said:
What is the owners concern about getting the car resprayed? The original paint, cost, or quality?



Call me a heathen, but I just never got the "original paint!!" mind-set. Personally, I'd much rather see a good looking paint job than a marred and swirled original paint. I can respect the values held from that point of view, but it's just not mine.
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I can't speak for him, but my impression is that it is quality. He is not married to the idea of original by any means; he owns two resto-mods (a chevelle and a camaro), both of which are miles from original. I think he just like that the 'vette is close to original/stock, and is afraid of someone messing it up. It's kind of a slippery slope when you start working on a car, of course. I don't think the cost is an issue aside from the fact that it is a surprise and may be considerable. I think it's more of a "dang, I'd rather not have to re-spray it" kind of thing.



RaskyR1 said:
I agree. To me a classic car such is this should be worth more correctly restored vs. one with a so so finish that's original.
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I agree. Unless the car will lose value I'm more of a 'do a bitchin' paint job' kind of guy too, but it isn't my car or money. :D



tdekany said:
My choice would be: wrapping the car.
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Thanks for the input. If it were my car I may go that route.



There is no real pressing need to do anything of course, I just thought I'd ask you guys since I respect your opinions!
 
Here is a similar car that I worked on a few years ago that was repainted by the owner and the finish was impeccable. Definitely one of the best resprays I have ever seen (even compared to factory jobs). Sorry no sun pics, but as you can see it was a little cloudy that day. Finding a good paint shop is difficult and I've only just recently found a local shop that I can refer my customers. I completely understand the "dang, I'd rather not have to re-spray it" attitude, though.



img_4526%28resized%29.jpg




I love the stingray 'vettes.
 
Many options to wade through. Ultimately up to the customer. Start sanding and polishing and it might be the last time a machine can touch it. Might prolong the inevitable though.



But water based painting seems prone to orange peel, under the solvent clear, terrible combination. So it might be a big bill to make it right.



Would X-Kote fill the etching?
 
Sorry, an easy way to check what X-Kote fills like, is to wipe an area with a solvent. Gives a good indication on the coverage and the paint condition. So it should be clayed and polished for best results, but it still might show defects. New paint is usually flawless, older paint might show defects, though some defects can be polished out after.



It might be a way to build up some clear.
 
salty said:
Many options to wade through. Ultimately up to the customer. Start sanding and polishing and it might be the last time a machine can touch it. Might prolong the inevitable though.



But water based painting seems prone to orange peel, under the solvent clear, terrible combination. So it might be a big bill to make it right.



Would X-Kote fill the etching?
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Plenty of shops still use traditional paints though. My father and I just resprayed an 1963 Austin Healey MKII with PPG concept single stage paint, which IMO is the way to go on classic cars anyway. ;)
 
RaskyR1 said:
Plenty of shops still use traditional paints though. My father and I just resprayed an 1963 Austin Healey MKII with PPG concept single stage paint, which IMO is the way to go on classic cars anyway. ;)
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Not to take this off-topic, but some older paints are simply unavailable. I (and my guys, who specialize in true classics) spend *years* tracking down the last cans of ss Rhodium Gray Metallic for my Jag, literally searched the world, found a few cans in the weirdest places. Couldn't quite find enough for all its needs :( And no, PPG/etc. all refused to mix some, even when told price was no object. The good ss stuff is going away, for good. BIIIIG problem for the prewar cars (guy with a REO just got it fixed after a dummy-incident in a parking lot, he's almost out of his backup paint now).
 
Accumulator said:
Not to take this off-topic, but some older paints are simply unavailable. I (and my guys, who specialize in true classics) spend *years* tracking down the last cans of ss Rhodium Gray Metallic for my Jag, literally searched the world, found a few cans in the weirdest places. Couldn't quite find enough for all its needs :( And no, PPG/etc. all refused to mix some, even when told price was no object. The good ss stuff is going away, for good. BIIIIG problem for the prewar cars (guy with a REO just got it fixed after a dummy-incident in a parking lot, he's almost out of his backup paint now).
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Really? Wonder what's in that color that they refuse to mix it. They have their own paint mixing system at my dads shop and I've never heard him mention not being able to make a certain color before.



Do you have the code for that Jag color? I'd be interested to see what my old man says. Maybe it lists what's in the formula that is no linger available?



I do agree that they old traditional paints are on their way out though. :(





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