"Jeweling" the paint

A

AudiOn19s

New member
I've seen several threads where this finishing technique is referenced. Is it simply however an extended finishing polishing session and nothing more...or are there specifics to it? I currently use LC grey or blue pads and PO85RD for my finishing work but this trade is something where I'm constantly looking for the next great thing to make my work that much better.



SOOO... I'm curious if we can have an informative thread with tips, tricks, technique and video even on Jeweling.



Andy
 
There seem to be differing definitions and techniques. I am darn curious to see what fills this thread.



Specifically what



-Pad(s)



-Product(s)



-Machinery AND Speed(s)
 
Jewelling is not some magical thing that makes paint looks amazingly better. It is really a term that I started using because I heard others use it as well to describe taking the paint to a higher level, even when it already looks close to perfect. This is has been done forever by porter cable users.



You can make paint defect free by using a medium polish and pad and make it look good. Most of the time using a finer polishing pad and finer polish will result in more glow or sharpness from the paint.



When you using a rotary it is possible to remove all the holograms and paint defects and still likely have microscopic defects on the paint's surface. Any defect that cannot be seen still scatters (or refracts) small amounts of light which can take away from the overall finish. To work out these microscopic defects you should use a pad with little to know abrasive (mechanical) property and a very fine abrasive that will finish down with no cutting power. Then slowly massage out these hidden defects which will end with the surface of the paint being more microscopically flat and true.



If the surface is milled like a diamond and flat it will reflect (instead of refract) more light which will increase the over all optics of the paint. As Ryan Blanchette (a friend and amazing paint polisher)/rydawg has said to me, "hell I'm just getting started when the paint looks perfect."



Also, since pads can and will abrade the clear coat’s surface and allow the carriers of the polish (most commonly mineral oil) to leech into the small abrasions, you can sometimes a light shadowing of holograms return up to several months later. The final jewelling step (or in some cases: steps) can eliminate the pad abrasions and prevent any defect return.



When we put 30 hours into a paint job, the paint has been perfect for 25. The last 5 hours are focused (thru trial and error) of finding the best combination of product, pad, and technique that will give us mind blowing results and make our haters think we are doctoring our photos (which is always nice when a client pops on here and comments the pictures do not do the car justice). Or when our cars win best paint at major shows, etc... It’s in the microscopic polishing and chasing 1%'s that makes all the difference, IMO.



Using a pad with the no mechanical ability (though harder paints can "tolerate" slight mechanical action such as a white LC pad on a Corvette for example) and an ultra fine polish and massaging the paint will moderate to lower RPMS (although you will want to use a little pressure at the beginning of the pass to help fracture the abrasives since the pad isn't providing abrasion) and backing the RPM to match the fracture rate of the abrasive of to ensure it is smoothly polishing it self out is my definition of jewelling. Experience and a keen eye to match the best finish to each paint is also necessary for best results, though you cannot start learning what works for you until you start trying.



Now keep in mind that on a professional level this will not make sense because a lot of clients are not willing to pay the money for the considerable amount of time required to jewel the paint perfectly. There are no set rules because each vehicle's paint is different (even same year/make/model) and we detail in dynamic environments. However once you have the paint perfect, dare to make it better. Never settle and you might be surprised!



Here is a video in which I explain what I feel are the merits of "jewelling" a finish and a small demonstration on a Ferrari.



Please ignore the stuttering in the video :D



<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/5ROqLZra-0E"> </param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/5ROqLZra-0E" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="350"> </embed> </object>



direct link



YouTube - Bella Macchina-Proper Paint Jeweling
 
IMO or should I say understanding Jeweling refers to the process of buffing strictly for gloss benefits as opposed to defect correction. This is usually an optional step just before the LSP is applied. I personally use FPII for this on a blue CCS pad.
 
If one uses PO85RD with a black or blue LC pack, does performing this step remove any clearcoat from a surface with soft clear?



How often can one "jewel" the paint without compromising clear?
 
You can't without removing clear. Like Todd said, it is still removing defects, just too small to pinpoint. The amount of clear lost with a non-abrasive pad and a polish like PO85RD would be almost negligible vs. the amount of clear lost with even a medium polish. If your clear is thin enough that PO85RD hurts it on a blue pad, it was probably ****ed to begin with :-)
 
TH0001,



Since you have so much experience in this area, could you suggest a product, pad and speed that would be good in general? I realize perfection means matching the media to the task, but for those of us without the expenience, is the a good general starting point?



Thanks.
 
Todd may reply, or maybe not. It seems he is leaving Autopia, at least for the time being. Not that I can speak for Todd AT ALL, or that I have nearly his experience, but from my observations of his work, it seems he would generally use one of the softer/finer finishing pads in the lake country line, with either 3m Ultrafina or one of Menzerna's lightest abrasives.
 
This "jeweling" is what some of us have also referred to as "burnishing".



It's something you do after you've already gotten things "as good as they're gonna get", scare-quotes intentional as you won't appreciate this step unless you do it on a finish that you would normally consider already perfect...you think it couldn't get better, then you do this final step and notice that it *did* get a little bit better after all.



Yeah, it removes a minscule amount of clear but not enough to bear thinking about. But it *is* still taking off paint, so I don't do this on the Jag or the RX-7 where maintaining paint thickness is my primary concern (not having to repaint an original time-capsule car is more important than the paint's finish).



I do mine with the Cyclo, blue Sonus pads, and something like 1z Pro MP (old version) or 1Z Wax Polish Soft.



I don't see any reason why it couldn't be done by hand (consider the "hand-rubbed lacquer" finishes from back in the day), but I bet that on *some* paints the PC might not be the best choice.



I'll try the Menzerna PO85RD sometime, but the 1Z stuff works OK on the hard clear of our Audis and the Denali XL. It's a matter of finding a pad/product/application method combo that's as close as possible to functionally nonabrasive *on the paint in question* while not being *literally* functionally nonabrasive the way something lile Meg's #3 Machine Polish would be (that's be "glazing" in my book, a different process).
 
D&D Auto Detail said:
You just want to use a light polish with a finishing pad (pad with no cut). For example, PO 85RD or PO 87MC with CCS gray, blue, or red.
Click to expand...



I agree.



The term jeweling is old painters term from the 40's 50's and 60's - when they used single stage paints and lot painters would buff and the paint and return the car to the owner. After a curing process they would have the customer bring the car back in and finish polish or what was normally called the jeweling of the surface to bring out the luster. This was very common and dark single stage paints.
 
DennisH- That's still not quite unheard-of even today :D My good painter wants the (ss lacquer) Jag back for that after the mechanical work is done, even though he knows that I'm gonna polish it to *my* satisfaction after he's done with it. He wants to make sure the areas he worked on are how *he* wants them and this final polishing on his part is part of his evaluation process.
 
Accumulator said:
DennisH- That's still not quite unheard-of even today :D My good painter wants the (ss lacquer) Jag back for that after the mechanical work is done, even though he knows that I'm gonna polish it to *my* satisfaction after he's done with it. He wants to make sure the areas he worked on are how *he* wants them and this final polishing on his part is part of his evaluation process.
Click to expand...



Yes, I agree one hundred percent, a lot highend shops that do street rods will also do call it a jeweling stage even on clear coat paints. The term of "jeweling" as dealing with final polishing has been around for at least 70 years so it is not new term nor a new process.
 
TH0001 said:
Jewelling is not some magical thing that makes paint looks amazingly better. It is really a term that I started using because I heard others use it as well to describe taking the paint to a higher level, even when it already looks close to perfect. This is has been done forever by porter cable users.



You can make paint defect free by using a medium polish and pad and make it look good. Most of the time using a finer polishing pad and finer polish will result in more glow or sharpness from the paint.



When you using a rotary it is possible to remove all the holograms and paint defects and still likely have microscopic defects on the paint's surface. Any defect that cannot be seen still scatters (or refracts) small amounts of light which can take away from the overall finish. To work out these microscopic defects you should use a pad with little to know abrasive (mechanical) property and a very fine abrasive that will finish down with no cutting power. Then slowly massage out these hidden defects which will end with the surface of the paint being more microscopically flat and true.



If the surface is milled like a diamond and flat it will reflect (instead of refract) more light which will increase the over all optics of the paint. As Ryan Blanchette (a friend and amazing paint polisher)/rydawg has said to me, "hell I'm just getting started when the paint looks perfect."



Also, since pads can and will abrade the clear coat’s surface and allow the carriers of the polish (most commonly mineral oil) to leech into the small abrasions, you can sometimes a light shadowing of holograms return up to several months later. The final jewelling step (or in some cases: steps) can eliminate the pad abrasions and prevent any defect return.



When we put 30 hours into a paint job, the paint has been perfect for 25. The last 5 hours are focused (thru trial and error) of finding the best combination of product, pad, and technique that will give us mind blowing results and make our haters think we are doctoring our photos (which is always nice when a client pops on here and comments the pictures do not do the car justice). Or when our cars win best paint at major shows, etc... It’s in the microscopic polishing and chasing 1%'s that makes all the difference, IMO.



Using a pad with the no mechanical ability (though harder paints can "tolerate" slight mechanical action such as a white LC pad on a Corvette for example) and an ultra fine polish and massaging the paint will moderate to lower RPMS (although you will want to use a little pressure at the beginning of the pass to help fracture the abrasives since the pad isn't providing abrasion) and backing the RPM to match the fracture rate of the abrasive of to ensure it is smoothly polishing it self out is my definition of jewelling. Experience and a keen eye to match the best finish to each paint is also necessary for best results, though you cannot start learning what works for you until you start trying.



Now keep in mind that on a professional level this will not make sense because a lot of clients are not willing to pay the money for the considerable amount of time required to jewel the paint perfectly. There are no set rules because each vehicle's paint is different (even same year/make/model) and we detail in dynamic environments. However once you have the paint perfect, dare to make it better. Never settle and you might be surprised!



Here is a video in which I explain what I feel are the merits of "jewelling" a finish and a small demonstration on a Ferrari.



Please ignore the stuttering in the video :D



<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/5ROqLZra-0E"> </param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/5ROqLZra-0E" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="350"> </embed> </object>



direct link



YouTube - Bella Macchina-Proper Paint Jeweling
Click to expand...





That was an *amazing* post. Autopia will be losing a huge asset if Todd decides to leave.
 
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