How is it possible to know if wax is layerable?

There are generally (and I am definitely generalizing here) two types of protection products:



1) Cleaner Waxes



These products have built-in cleaning agents that are designed to clean imperfections on the paint and chemically prepare it for another layer of a different product, or as a stand-alone.



2) Pure Waxes (or sealants)



These products have no such chemical cleaning abilities. The idea behind these products is that you have already spent so much time preparing the paint (i.e. washing, using clay, and polishing) that there is no need for such a product and/or you have already used a cleaner wax.



These products you can layer because each successive layer will not chemically remove the one below it.



e.g. You cannot layer Klasse AIO but you can layer Klasse SG as many times as you like.
 
ok that makes sense. now another question lol. would dwg decrease the life of collinite 845 or any sealant if its layered underneath?
 
drg said:
ok that makes sense. now another question lol. would dwg decrease the life of collinite 845 or any sealant if its layered underneath?
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I think it would. While the gloss will be greatly improved using this combination (either one), the best durability will be from a single application of your chosen LSP.
 
It's been a while since I posted this and I doubt it'd turn up in a reasonable-effort search..here's how I test for layering:



Do your normal prep on a panel and apply a coat of LSP to the entire panel. Determine a proper cure/etc. timeframe for the layering (I usually wait at least a day) and apply a second application to half the panel.



Repeat a few times, alway adding to the same half of the panel.



Apply one more time to the *entire* panel to equalize the starting time for both sides and commence the observation period.



(At this point you may or may not see a difference between the two sides...if you *do*, and you like the difference, then that might be enough to convince you that something that you like is going on and maybe you'll want to do multiple applications based on that. *BUT* it might just be an accumulation of oils like with the old "concours waxing" technique, which will be mighty short-lived and isn't true layering.)



Wait and see if the multi-applications side beads/stays slick/looks good/whatever your criteria longer than the only-two-applications side. IME when a product truly layers it's not a subtle difference, the multi side stays "waxed" a *lot* longer than the only-two side...weeks or even months longer.
 
Although the number of "layers" is subject to debate, multiple coats always help to ensure even and adequate coverage. In my personal experience, 4-5 layers is the point of diminishing returns.
 
nbhs1 said:
Do you have any particular favorites for layering?
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KSG is perfect. Four layers is good, six is better. I'm just starting to experiment with FK1000P and I think it'll work out about the same.



Collinite waxes seem to layer, especially the 845. With the pastes, sometimes the solvent content can throw a monkey wrench in the works (I think that's what happened, only happened once out of a zillion times so I'm kinda :confused: ), so with those I'd spitshine if you get the pseudo-hologram effect that indicates solvent action.



Meg's #16 layers if you wait a few days between applications. I still like to do a pseudo-spitshine with some carnauba-base QD with it though.



(Pseudo-spitshine = spritz a little water/QD on the panel before applying the wax, but then just apply the wax normally instead of working it until it nearly disappears as with a true spit-shine.)



With other waxes I almost always spitshine (true or pseudo), and a lot of paste waxes will layer if you do that. The seldom-mentioned Malm's liquid wax layers (or at least it did last time I tried it), and you can even end up with a wax buildup that will dull the finish.



With sealants like UPP and BF I dunno...the slickness drops after a few washes off no matter how many applications I do but I *suspect* they still layer.



One product that "shouldn't" layer (scare-quotes intentional ;) ) but does if you apply the subequent applications gently, is AutoGlym SRP. I can't get KAIO to do it the same way, or at least not to the same extent.



This post must be a record for the use of "pseudo" :o but I can't come up with a better way to express those ideas :nixweiss
 
Thanks for the well tought out response.I currently have one coat of 875 on a black Pilot and wondered about adding one of 476s on top.From your response maybe I'll stick with 875.



Have my Vette to do next a Machine silver 04. Silver is great for not showing imperfections but on the other hand the shine isn't to dramatic.Comments regarding this often refer to SSII as a better response for silver.Either that or I'll stick with 875 or 476s.I can get a little nutty about this, paralysis by analysis.
 
When layering products, do you do it during a couple of days or do you drive the car and wash it and just apply another layer?
 
Mark77 said:
When layering products, do you do it during a couple of days or do you drive the car and wash it and just apply another layer?
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Crappy but honest answer: it just depends. Note that I have a shop that stays *very* clean and a scad of vehicles, so I can leave something in the shop to do the layering if I choose to. That's a luxury that I truly appreciate.



With KSG, I always get at least four layers over at least four days, and I get a few applications of UPP on the S8 before driving it on the rare occasions that I've polished it. When I start using FK1000P on something I plan to get a few layers on before driving it.



But I use waxes more than sealants and I'm generally OK with driving it after only one application. Exception: with Collinite, I often do one coat of 845 topped with one coat of 476S, a combo I sorta stumbled across when experimenting and liked better than I'd expected to.
 
citizen arcane said:
With sealants, if the car hasn't been driven then I top the next day. If it has then I wait 'til the next wash.
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Depends how dirty it got. If just a little dusty, QD and apply sealant.
 
I agree with Accumulator on spit shinning. Most if not all nuba waxes have solvents in them. The idea of spit shinning is to disperse the solvents when applying the next coat. The cold water will keep the previous layer from dissolving.
 
Legacy99 said:
.. The idea of spit shinning is to disperse the solvents when applying the next coat. The cold water will keep the previous layer from dissolving.
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Note the *COLD* in the above... :xyxthumbs It does make a difference. Not always a *crucial* difference, but it's still good to chill whatever you're using for spit.
 
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