**** Griot and Bob Carver

E

elbee

New member
It seems these two men have a lot in common. Both came right out of the gate telling us their products are the best--and why the rest are inferior. I did a Griot's search and came across one thread and it had more than 2500 hits! It seems not many talk about these two men's products but when their names are mentioned everyone flocks to to see what is being said.



Well, I've owned Carver amps and am currently using Griot's products and I love them. I guess I just prefer a warm sound to my music as well as a warm shine on my car. Anyone else enjoy this?



I also love Pirelli tires but no one seems to talk about/recommend them, either.
 
Er... I think that the reason that no one talks much about Griot's stuff is due to the fact that their stuff ranks extremely low on the price/performance ratio, and they totally overprice things like their PC kit and such. You can get a lot of better products than Griot's for the money, IMO.



And last I checked, Pirelli tires were factory spec for Ferrari street cars. That's a pretty good recommendation, if you ask me ;)



-Bob
 
Carver's products have always piqued my interest, but they have somehow never made their way into my system. :nixweiss I don't think his products are superior to everything else out there. My amps and preamp manufacturer, Linn, also has an owner which some in the industry consider a bit pompous. I don't think they are the end all be all components, but perform nicely for the wide range of music I like. Like wax products, I don't believe in one "best" stereo product. There are a number of poor to mediocre products, some good, and some outstanding, but no best. Working to mix and match products to perform to please is part of the fun of both hobbies.
 
I'd add Bose to the list. The impression I get

with these companies that salesmanship comes before solid engineering. Tell a good storyand follow it with a quick hocus-pocus demo and people will buy your stuff. It doesn't matter if you use cheap paper cones or undersized transformers. I do not have first-hand experience with Griot's but I also get the impression that its prices are elevated by a good sales pitch.



Spectral/Acoustat/SOTA + >6500 lps
 
I have yet to try any Griot's products, so I can't really comment on them...



but I will say that while Pirelli tires are nice, there's better out there ;)
 
elbee said:
It seems these two men have a lot in common. Both came right out of the gate telling us their products are the best--and why the rest are inferior. I did a Griot's search and came across one thread and it had more than 2500 hits! It seems not many talk about these two men's products but when their names are mentioned everyone flocks to to see what is being said.



Well, I've owned Carver amps and am currently using Griot's products and I love them. I guess I just prefer a warm sound to my music as well as a warm shine on my car. Anyone else enjoy this?



I also love Pirelli tires but no one seems to talk about/recommend them, either.
Click to expand...



Interesting that this subject came up after I read the following article yesterday. It puts an interesting spin on the subject and begs the question - Are Griots and Carver too expensive? Conversely, has the big box mentality becoming the norm and selling cheap made regularly priced products seem expensive? Give it a read. http://www.carwashmag.com/ and go to the july issue and the article is called "Tools: Why Wouldn't You Want to Use the Best?".
 
beastie said:
I'd add Bose to the list. The impression I get

with these companies that salesmanship comes before solid engineering. Tell a good storyand follow it with a quick hocus-pocus demo and people will buy your stuff.
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I couldn't agree more. The Bose Wave systems sound decent, but no better than the $49.99 Labtec computer speakers I have (2 small speakers and an 8" x 8" x 8" sized subwoofer). If the Bose Wave was $150, then it would be a decent deal since you can get good sound in a very compact unit, but for $400? No way!



I am not fond of Bose audio systems and even the Mark Levinson systems in the Lexus's is not what I expected it to be, especially after hearing the raves from the car mags. Apparently, none of them has heard a decent $750-1000 aftermarket car audio system. Not that the Levinson system sounds bad; it is very good for a factory system but any good aftermarket setup will blow it away and for less money.



Carver amps are expensive, but they are among the best. My brother had some in a CRX powering 15" Kicker subs and the sound was not only incredibly loud, but real clean too. Worth the premium price? Maybe to a true audiophile, but the average person probably wouldn't hear much difference.
 
I hope you're not lumping Carver in with Bose--give Bob a little more credit. Actually, he's moved on, his Sunfire stuff is top notch.



Back to Griot's. I certainly wouldn't pay 89 bucks for a hose nozzle or 27 bucks for the oil filter wrench (same thing at AutoZone for 7 dollars) but 20 bucks for something like the BOS is entirely reasonable. Just choose wisely.
 
elbee said:
I hope you're not lumping Carver in with Bose--give Bob a little more credit. Actually, he's moved on, his Sunfire stuff is top notch.
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I wouldn't dare!



I've never understood the fascination with Bose. I remember how everyone raved about the 901 series speakers they had (the home speakers) in the late 70's and early 80's and to me, they sounded muddied. Too much midrange, barely adequate bass and pi$$ poor treble. I thought my Inifinty Qb's (10" woofer and a single EMIT tweeter) sounded a lot better and they were about 1/4th the price.
 
Scottwax said:
I wouldn't dare!



I've never understood the fascination with Bose. I remember how everyone raved about the 901 series speakers they had (the home speakers) in the late 70's and early 80's and to me, they sounded muddied. Too much midrange, barely adequate bass and pi$$ poor treble. I thought my Inifinty Qb's (10" woofer and a single EMIT tweeter) sounded a lot better and they were about 1/4th the price.
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My stepmother from hell was looking to buy a shelf system and I specifically told her NOT to buy anything Bose. So what does her husband do?He proceeds to buy not one but TWO Acoustic Wave boxes at a thousand bucks a pop! But hey, the man still uses Turtle Wax....
 
Scottwax said:
I am not fond of Bose audio systems and even the Mark Levinson systems in the Lexus's is not what I expected it to be, especially after hearing the raves from the car mags. Apparently, none of them has heard a decent $750-1000 aftermarket car audio system.
Click to expand...



In fairness, most Bose car systems are not that expensive. Mine was about $450 and sounds nicer than the factory setup; it sounds very nice to my ears. Plus, it integrates well into the dash, can be controlled by the steering wheel, adjusts the volume based on the car's velocity, and dims and brightens with the rest of the interior lighting. Those small things are difficult to impossible to get from aftermarket systems. So, while I wouldn't claim it's the best stereo out there, I do feel it is definitely worth the money. Just two pennies tossed out there...
 
I'd have to partially agree/disagree with the Bose comments. Nearly every Bose car audio system I've ever listened to has not impressed me the least bit. Bose doesn't make the effort to create a proper sound stage and the systems lack the clarity of something like Eclipse. Scott is right that a good aftermarket system will sound superior but I would put that at a cost of $3K rather than $1K.



On the home speaker side of things our house had the Acoustimass setup already installed and I'm not too thrilled with its sound. It lacks the highs/deep bass and left and right channels are lost IMO. OTOH I have a set of Bose 901's (bought on ebay) which sound better than anything I've listened to in the same price range. Keep in mind that they will sound like absolute *^*% (muddy) if they're installed incorrectly or in the wrong environment, trust me this makes a significant difference.



In the past couple of years I've done everything I can to isolate myself from audio electronics. I found myself paying absurd amounts of money to get the sound I wanted and then losing it all when I traded the car or moved from the apt/house. Lesson learned.



Regarding Griots, there's no doubt majority of their products are expensive. But if you don't have the time and want quality products it is a major convenience as a one stop shop. I've purchased a few items for the garage as well as a few of their products for that exact reason. There are some Griots products that just can't be beat like Undercarriage Spray and their glass cleaner.
 
Yes, I did lump Bose and Carver together. Bose is the worse offender but Carver also pulled hocus-pocus like the "transfer-function" BS back in the 80's where he claimed to be able to make his amps sound exactly like Conrad-Johnson's Premier 5 tube amps and one of Krell's amps. I've heard C-J amps and Carver's amp was nowhere near it sonically. My brother bought a Carver FM tuner based on Stereo Review's glowing praise of it. It was not better sounding nor was it an RF miracle worker. It was, at best, average. I've heard of dealers dropping Carver (the company) because of incidences that some of his products burned up because of cheap capacitors or transformers. Sunfire has been a step up, maybe even marvelous, specially their subs. But Bob Carver's companies have been more geared toward bringing the most bang for the buck and not to define state of the art. He is a good businessman and a decent engineer whose goal is to have a nice bottom line by putting inexpensive components and making something that would be marketable and be able to fetch a premium price. Hmmm, if I changed the name Bose for everytime I wrote Carver, the story would ring similar but in a loudspeaker sense. Just my humble opinion although I know it rings true for very many audiophiles.
 
The great myths about Griots products......



1. You can buy most of their products else where cheaper.



I fgure there are probably 500 products in their catalogue? I know maybe 15 (exact) products I have seen else where cheaper. The next time someone says you can buy most of their products cheaper else where, please post the details for the other 485 products please.



2. The products are expensive.



Yeah...well so is my time. I buy car care products from 3 vendors (Griots is one). If I dropped Griots I'd have to add another 5 or more vendors to deal with. Thats a hassle... period. And are the other vendors going to offer a lifetime money back guarantee? Several times Griots have just given stuff to me for free in the interest of customer satisfaction.



Folks, stocking all that stuff, producing a great catalogue, offering a lifetime money back guarantee and providing the best service in the industry does cost you know. You pay for what you get.



I was very sceptical about Griots at first. But virtually every product I bought was excellent quality...even the way the stuff is packed is first class...(no damn peanut foam here!).
 
I agree with JB in Irvine !



It is a pleasure to deal with people at Griot's...



Every product is top quality...



Griot's gets my permanent business:up
 
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