Finally Tried the Twins

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Well, this weekend I finally tried the Klasse Twins (thanks to DavidB getting them shipped to me in 2 days!!!). I've got to say that AIO is all it's hyped up to be, easy to use and left a sqeaky clean finish for the SG. With all the posts of how difficult SG is to remove, I was really prepared for a tough time with the SG. I was surprised that it went on really thin and easy using a dry terry app and buffed off just as easilly (after 1 hour dry time) with a damp MF and final buff with a dry MF. I was able to get two coats of SG on with a QD in between with Sonus (umm, smells like pina colada).



I've been using SEC and S100 for quite a while and have been really happy with the depth and shine, but things have been really busy lately and I've needed a little more on the durability end. The Twins sure to provide a high gloss and a really slick surface, but lack the depth of the S100. I'm not sure I'm in love with it, but if durability is as promised, I'll be happy. Maybe try topping with S100.



Here are some pretty bad photos, as it was really cloudy and I still haven't been able to take good photos on cloudy days with my digicam.



Michael



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mpauly- Glad to hear you got good results from the twins. I know EXACTLY what you mean about not being thrilled with the look, especially on your color of car. If you can somehow get another few layers of SG on there before topping (yes, I think the P21S topper will be a good idea in your case) you will still have unbelievable durability even after/if the P21S goes away. I get months and months out of a few layers of SG (nearly a year on some cars).
 
I also tried the Klasse twins on my wife's Black Mustang this weekend. It was a real eye opener. I did not realize how scratched and swirled the mustang's hood was until after I finished.



I realize now that the AIO actually clarified the paint to show all the nasty scratches and swirls that blackfire had hidden.



I do have to add that SG went on smoothly and I did top it off with S100. Nevertheless, the scratches and swirls are still there...Andrew
 
Michael, nice Passat! I love Silverstone Grey... you can't see the swirls, yet it shines when clean.



However, unless you give time for SG to cure (preferably 24 hours), applying it a second time doesn't add another layer. Theoretically, it softens the old layer and reapplies itself. Also I'm not sure if you'll see a benefit on the protection front. S100/P21S beads more than Klasse IMO.



Nice job with the pictures and details!
 
a Passat with the klasse twins.... just wait until YoSteve gets ahold of you! (Where has that character been lately, BTW?) Lookin' good! :xyxthumbs
 
BW said:
Michael, nice Passat! I love Silverstone Grey... you can't see the swirls, yet it shines when clean.



However, unless you give time for SG to cure (preferably 24 hours), applying it a second time doesn't add another layer. Theoretically, it softens the old layer and reapplies itself. Also I'm not sure if you'll see a benefit on the protection front. S100/P21S beads more than Klasse IMO.



Nice job with the pictures and details!
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I too love the color!! Hides all sorts of defects. I have a few swirls that the dealer installed before delivery and probably when I first got started detailing before I found Autopia. There are only a few and they are only seen under bright direct light, so I haven't been real compelled to remove them.



I don't know how you guys keep up with a black paint job!



When I applied the SG, I did wait at least 24 hours between coats. Not sure I read your reply right, but are you saying that after the cure time, a second coat doesn't add anything (it can't be layered)? I've read quite a bit to the benefit of multiple layers of SG (with at least 24 hours between) but after 3 there is little visual benfit. Am I right here?



I'll definitley try a S100 topper after a 3rd coat of SG.



Thanks for the complements.



Michael
 
stanger99 said:
Are you saying that S100 provides more protection than Klasse?
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Klasse twins last longer than s100, they aren't caranuba based, and provide better protection from dirt, waterspots, uv rays, winter, etc... HOwver, s100 is pretty dang easy to use, and has great depth, a good combo is klasse aio and s100 or the twins and s100. Im very uneasy about using just a caranuba wax on a daily driver bc it goes through so much, your better off just having an acrylic or polymer on your paint then a caranuba. But if you want the best of both worlds, a synthetic wax topped with a caranuba wax looks very very good.
 
Abercrombie2582 said:
Klasse twins last longer than s100, they aren't caranuba based, and provide better protection from dirt, waterspots, uv rays, winter, etc... HOwver, s100 is pretty dang easy to use, and has great depth, a good combo is klasse aio and s100 or the twins and s100. Im very uneasy about using just a caranuba wax on a daily driver bc it goes through so much, your better off just having an acrylic or polymer on your paint then a caranuba. But if you want the best of both worlds, a synthetic wax topped with a caranuba wax looks very very good.
Click to expand...



I have quite a bit of experience with many sealants/synthetics/polymers/whatever and many carnauba waxes. :p

I was just wandering why he said that Klasse doesn't provide more protection than a short lived carnauba:confused:



But thanks anyway for the response:xyxthumbs
 
your car looks beautiful! very reflective.



I just did my big spring/summer detail with the twins a couple of weeks ago. seeing that sg is a pain to remove, i decided to experiment with the removal. i usually apply sg to the whole car, let it dry for an hour, then buff it off. this time i applied it to a panel or section and immediately buffed it off. as a side note, i did not use any qd, sonus or otherwise, to aid in removal.
 
BillNorth said:
your car looks beautiful! very reflective.



I just did my big spring/summer detail with the twins a couple of weeks ago. seeing that sg is a pain to remove, i decided to experiment with the removal. i usually apply sg to the whole car, let it dry for an hour, then buff it off. this time i applied it to a panel or section and immediately buffed it off. as a side note, i did not use any qd, sonus or otherwise, to aid in removal.
Click to expand...



This was my first time with the twins, so I'm by no means an expert or even experienced, so take this for what it's worth. Everything I did was as recommended by others here at Autopia. After using AIO, I applied the SG to the whole car and then let it sit/cure for 1 hour. Then I used a MF dampened with plain old water to remove the SG and then a dry MF to buff to a shine. It was suprisingly super easy. Aside from the 1 hour wait time, it was just as easy as the S100. I kept saying "It can't be this easy." Did I do anything wrong?



I didn't need any QD to remove the SG, but because the coats were applied in two consecutive days I used the Sonus QD to clean off any dust. The Sonus is supposedly the same acrylic stuff as the SG so there are no bonding or compatability issues. Plus it smells real nice and buffs of easilly and streak free.



Michael
 
stanger99 said:
Are you saying that S100 provides more protection than Klasse?
Click to expand...



I can't answer for him, but I think he was talking more about the beading than about the level of protection. I did a little test and sprayed some water on the twins and the S100 does have tighter more uniform beads, but not by a huge margin. The problem with the S100 is that those beads seem to get bigger and uglier after about a weeks worth of driving (my car also sits outside 24/7). And as we all know, the carnuba only lasts at a max 6-8 weeks, probably less on my car.



Like I said before, if the twins last 4-6 months as promised, I'll be happy. Maybe when my schedule is a little easier or my living situation changes and I can easilly detail at will, I'll switch back to carnuba and it's maintenance requirements.



Michael
 
Nice looking Passat mpauly! :xyxthumbs I'm glad the Klasse twins worked out well for you.

BillNorth said:
seeing that sg is a pain to remove, i decided to experiment with the removal. i usually apply sg to the whole car, let it dry for an hour, then buff it off. this time i applied it to a panel or section and immediately buffed it off.
Click to expand...
Wow, talk about unconventional (and brave). ;) I don't think anyone has ever even considered trying it this way, given people are always talking about "curing" and "crosslinking" etc etc.... I wonder if this method has any negative effects, such as not actually putting on a full layer? Then again, how are you really going to prove it... :p
 
4DSC said:
Nice looking Passat mpauly! :xyxthumbs I'm glad the Klasse twins worked out well for you.

Wow, talk about unconventional (and brave). ;) I don't think anyone has ever even considered trying it this way, given people are always talking about "curing" and "crosslinking" etc etc.... I wonder if this method has any negative effects, such as not actually putting on a full layer? Then again, how are you really going to prove it... :p
Click to expand...



I should have mentioned in my initial post that SG is WAY easier for me to remove using my new method.



IMHO, dry time before buffing doesn't affect curing, crosslinking, etc. Your paint can only accept a certain amount of wax, sealant, etc. What ever you buff off is the extra unneeded stuff. There is still product sitting on your paint that is curing. It shouldn't matter if you wait an hour or a minute.



I remmeber back in the day when Don and Beau were applying klasse like this and they were achieving fantastic results. I guess we'll see. I don't mind being the guinea pig. :D
 
mpauly said:
This was my first time with the twins, so I'm by no means an expert or even experienced, so take this for what it's worth. Everything I did was as recommended by others here at Autopia. After using AIO, I applied the SG to the whole car and then let it sit/cure for 1 hour. Then I used a MF dampened with plain old water to remove the SG and then a dry MF to buff to a shine. It was suprisingly super easy. Aside from the 1 hour wait time, it was just as easy as the S100. I kept saying "It can't be this easy." Did I do anything wrong?



I didn't need any QD to remove the SG, but because the coats were applied in two consecutive days I used the Sonus QD to clean off any dust. The Sonus is supposedly the same acrylic stuff as the SG so there are no bonding or compatability issues. Plus it smells real nice and buffs of easilly and streak free.



Michael
Click to expand...



You did an excellent job for the first time!



I experimented with the removal of the product because IMHO, SG is very difficult to remove. My new method, which I just did again tonight, is much easier. Granted you and I remove klasse in a different manner. You use an MF dampened with water, I use a dry charisma. I used to use water like yourself, but I found that it had an adverse effect on the appearance of my SG. My SG started to haze and look cloudy. It had an oily type film on it. That's why I switched over to dry towels and applicators to apply and remove. This has solved my problem.



Also, in your post, you refer to the time you let your klasse sit before buffing off as "curing". Curing is actually the time required between coats of a product. Klasse requires 24 hours between coats. What you are actually referring to is drying time. This is what I have been experimenting with.



No worries though. Experimenting is what detailing is all about. Your car looks great! Cheers! :xyxthumbs
 
Once SG is applied and let it sit for 1 hour and buffed with MF, can S100 be applied right afterwards? Do you have to wait 24 hours for SG to cure and then S100?
 
Yes, you should wait 24 hours first, just to be safe, since I think it's been said that it would inhibit curing.





Thanks for the info BillNorth. I must've missed those threads about them doing it this way in my archive milking. :D
 
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