Buying a PGM

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GS4_Fiend

New member
Which Paint Gauge Meter do you guys recommend?



How much clear could a PC with 4 inch pad w/ a light cutting polish remove? (At speed 6 at slow pace)
 
i have no idea, but i know everyones gna need to know the type of pad your using, most will probably want to know the polish too
 
I'd recommend the Highline II that I use to anyone looking for a good device on a budget. Don't get a probe, cool blue back-lit display, or a metal housing, but you will get accurate readings on steel and aluminum
 
I was planning to get the Highline Meter too. Are there different versions? Don't know the history of the Highline Meter either. Thanks for the inputs.



Where can I get the Highline Meter? A known place please.
 
GS4_Fiend said:
I was planning to get the Highline Meter too. Are there different versions? Don't know the history of the Highline Meter either. Thanks for the inputs.



Where can I get the Highline Meter? A known place please.
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Hey I think you should get the Highline II gauge :p
 
Alright guys... I received my HighLine Meter II!!!! Very excited... Now the problem is how you use it? I don't even understand the numbers on the screens. All I see is numbers. LOL. Please help.
 
GS4_Fiend said:
Alright guys... I received my HighLine Meter II!!!! Very excited... Now the problem is how you use it? I don't even understand the numbers on the screens. All I see is numbers. LOL. Please help.
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First, press it against the bare metal plate that comes with it and make sure it's reading zero on both mil and micron settings.



Using it it's quite simple... just press it so it's flat against the paint, and wait for a number to pop up. Check a few times in the same area (area being a 2-3 square inch area) to make sure you're pressing it correctly and getting the same readings.



Small guide to the numbers: You will get readings anywhere from 4mil to 6mil on new(er) cars and original paint. Since this reads total thickness to metal (primer, base, and clear) a good idea is to check thickness on a few places inside door jambs, underside of hood, etc. as these areas are usually not clear coated. This gives you total clear coat thickness.



Usually clear coat thickness is 1-2mils (I found on most cars it's near 2 or more, but quite a few read about 1-1.5 so just be careful and triple check everything). The usual recommendation is to remove no more than .3-.5mil of clear coat, meaning about 1/5-1/4 total removal during the vehicle's lifetime. This is only a recommendation but I think it's a good one to follow.



A mil is 25.4 microns, and I recommend always using microns because you will tell easier how much paint is being removed due to the smaller unit of measure. According to the 'rule' above, if clear coat is 1.5 mils, it's ~38microns. 1/5 of that is 7.6 microns. To put that in perspective, PFW/M95or105/rotary remove 1-2microns on average (based on my use of the combo and my experience of course) and a medium combo following that (like SIP/orange or white or M8006) will remove 1 micron or less. Finishing polishes won't even register with the gauge.



Hope this helps.
 
lecchilo said:
First, press it against the bare metal plate that comes with it and make sure it's reading zero on both mil and micron settings.



Using it it's quite simple... just press it so it's flat against the paint, and wait for a number to pop up. Check a few times in the same area (area being a 2-3 square inch area) to make sure you're pressing it correctly and getting the same readings.



Small guide to the numbers: You will get readings anywhere from 4mil to 6mil on new(er) cars and original paint. Since this reads total thickness to metal (primer, base, and clear) a good idea is to check thickness on a few places inside door jambs, underside of hood, etc. as these areas are usually not clear coated. This gives you total clear coat thickness.



Usually clear coat thickness is 1-2mils (I found on most cars it's near 2 or more, but quite a few read about 1-1.5 so just be careful and triple check everything). The usual recommendation is to remove no more than .3-.5mil of clear coat, meaning about 1/5-1/4 total removal during the vehicle's lifetime. This is only a recommendation but I think it's a good one to follow.



A mil is 25.4 microns, and I recommend always using microns because you will tell easier how much paint is being removed due to the smaller unit of measure. According to the 'rule' above, if clear coat is 1.5 mils, it's ~38microns. 1/5 of that is 7.6 microns. To put that in perspective, PFW/M95or105/rotary remove 1-2microns on average (based on my use of the combo and my experience of course) and a medium combo following that (like SIP/orange or white or M8006) will remove 1 micron or less. Finishing polishes won't even register with the gauge.



Hope this helps.
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Ahaha.. I knew you would chime in Ivan. I will try out your acknowledgement and will tell you about it. Anyways, which piece am I suppose to use to calibrate with to get accuracy on the paint? Am I suppose to use the blue tab or silver tab?. And that's it for now and I really appreciate your help pal. Thanks. :bow



BTW, did your Highline Meter II come with a battery?
 
GS4_Fiend said:
Ahaha.. I knew you would chime in Ivan. I will try out your acknowledgement and will tell you about it. Anyways, which piece am I suppose to use to calibrate with to get accuracy on the paint? Am I suppose to use the blue tab or silver tab?. And that's it for now and I really appreciate your help pal. Thanks. :bow



BTW, did your Highline Meter II come with a battery?
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Mine came ready to go. You need to use the bare metal piece to make sure it reads 0.
 
lecchilo said:
Mine came ready to go. You need to use the bare metal piece to make sure it reads 0.
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Ok. I tried out the PGM today. The probe do have a sharp edge which could actually scratch the paint. Anyways. I took the reading on the bumper it registered 34.1 milli. Did the hood got 1.5 milli. So the place that got more milli, does that means it got repainted or oversprayed? How many milli equals to no more clear coat? Is there a minimum number to judge by? Thanks.
 
GS4_Fiend said:
Ok. I tried out the PGM today. The probe do have a sharp edge which could actually scratch the paint. Anyways. I took the reading on the bumper it registered 34.1 milli. Did the hood got 1.5 milli. So the place that got more milli, does that means it got repainted or oversprayed? How many milli equals to no more clear coat? Is there a minimum number to judge by? Thanks.
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WHAT? what's milli? And is the bumper plastic? This gauge can't/shouldn't be able to measure on plastic. 1.5 mils sounds way too low for the hood and 34.1 is just a weird number compared to 1.5 on the hood so I think you did something wrong/weird. Measure the hood again and when you get the measurement, switch from mils to microns to see both numbers. Lower number will be the mil.
 
lecchilo said:
WHAT? what's milli? And is the bumper plastic? This gauge can't/shouldn't be able to measure on plastic. 1.5 mils sounds way too low for the hood and 34.1 is just a weird number compared to 1.5 on the hood so I think you did something wrong/weird. Measure the hood again and when you get the measurement, switch from mils to microns to see both numbers. Lower number will be the mil.
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Sorry. I meant to say "Mils". It's much easier for me. Like I said, On the hood, I actually go 1.5 Mils. and the bumper I got 34.1 Mils. If it's plastic, it won't even register and will say "0". The car is a 2003 black onyx clear coat. What is the range am I suppose to be within using "Mils"? That's why I'm scared to fix my buffer trails.
 
GS4_Fiend said:
Sorry. I meant to say "Mils". It's much easier for me. Like I said, On the hood, I actually go 1.5 Mils. and the bumper I got 34.1 Mils. If it's plastic, it won't even register and will say "0". The car is a 2003 black onyx clear coat. What is the range am I suppose to be within using "Mils"? That's why I'm scared to fix my buffer trails.
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You should be seeing 0 on any plastic panels and on the metal calibration piece. Make sure you check that it reads 0 on the bare metal piece that came with the gauge.



As for the hood, average primer+base that I've seen is 2-2.5 mils, rarely close to 3. This is from my experience measuring uncleared panels, like underside of hood, door jambs, etc. As for total paint on the car, say somewhere like the hood, I see anywhere from 3.5-4 to 5.5-6. What kind of a car is this and what year? Any previous work done? If you're getting a reading of 1.5 mils it's either very thin paint or something's wrong with the gauge. I'm guessing it's the gauge if you got a reading of 30something on plastic...
 
lecchilo said:
You should be seeing 0 on any plastic panels and on the metal calibration piece. Make sure you check that it reads 0 on the bare metal piece that came with the gauge.



As for the hood, average primer+base that I've seen is 2-2.5 mils, rarely close to 3. This is from my experience measuring uncleared panels, like underside of hood, door jambs, etc. As for total paint on the car, say somewhere like the hood, I see anywhere from 3.5-4 to 5.5-6. What kind of a car is this and what year? Any previous work done? If you're getting a reading of 1.5 mils it's either very thin paint or something's wrong with the gauge. I'm guessing it's the gauge if you got a reading of 30something on plastic...
Click to expand...



It came with 2 pieces for calibration. One is light weight and it's blue. The other is heavier (must be the metal one) and it's grey. So I used the grey one to calibrate it and the meter reads "0". I tested the hood and it registered 1.5 Mils. The car is not repainted. The meter can only take readings from metals, steel, or aluminum. On any other objects like plastic, it would register "0". The car got holograms before. I bought it from an independent dealership. And was irritated by the holograms, so I decided to invest in the PC kit. First time user, I polish my own most valuable car to me with burdens. So my first time polishing experience on a car that I shouldn't take first try on, but which I did. So now I'm not too good with polishing, I lefted behind buffer trails. For me to polish one complete panel, I do 2 passes with Menzerna Power Finish on 4" very light cutting pad (LC Green pad) speed 5-6. Then finish it with Menzerna p085rd on 4" polishing pad. I couldn't see much of the buffer trail until I washed the car. Even though I did do an IPA wipedown. Wonder why. So then, I told myself to invest in some glazes like PBH, which was a fail. Then planned to buy a paint gauge. Now here I am being a noob. After all, I think that's why my hood is at 1.5 Mils. Obviously the dealers they polish the cars themselves before saling the cars. They usually use those 10" pads that they reuse until the pads are officially flat. And would polish the car on a rotary which is a big no-no. So yea. =\
 
Ok. So I re-calibrated it again. Took the readings again. The hood is still registering 1.5 Mils. I think I'm going to have clear coat failure soon. This is bad. As for the bumper at the first reading it registers 31 Mils. So I took a few more readings on the bumper again but different places, it registers "0". So it is plastic after all. Now this is making me confused. Is my meter bad? How could it get a reading from plastic at one time and not the other? Bizzare.
 
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