Bumper Scuff

S

socarecon

New member
to make it simple - yes you can apply polish / wax / sealant to fresh clear coat (it's not paint on top it's clearcoat). Let's look at the steps when a car is painted.

1. painted with a base coat (paint) - usually urathane

2. clearcoat is applied on top of the base coat

3. the base coat / clearcoat is allowed to dry 24hrs or bake dry

4. the car / or panel is then colorsanded and buffed out with guess what - compounds, polish, wax etc. Could you see a angry customer after a wreck not getting their car back 30 days after the car was base coat / clearcoated was completed if this was true! The above is done to remove fisheye etc. to achive the factory type of finish - somtimes it's better than, no orange peal on the repair a dead give away if the car has been repainted or repaired. This is for repaints and no different on factory paint they both have clearcoat finish

Another point of view - what about that $500.00 sealant the auto dealers sell for the new cars they sure don't tell the customer to wait 30 days before we apply it and to make another point it costs only $25.00, thats biz



Most clearcoats if forced dried (heat dried) can be buffed on within 1 hour. As I do my bumper blends, when needed. otay!
 
Polish and wax are not the same things. Yes you can polish fresh paint, but you can't use a carnauba wax on it, unless the paint is baked. Shops often don't have the money for the baking equipment. Fish eyes can't be removed by wet sanding or polishing, without repainting. Fish eyes are Pinholes in the paint caused by surface contamination, silicone, moisture and oil.
 
<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

<em class='bbc'>Originally posted by terry young [/i]
<strong class='bbc'>4. the car / or panel is then colorsanded and buffed out with guess what - compounds, polish, wax etc. Could you see a angry customer after a wreck not getting their car back 30 days after the car was base coat / clearcoated was completed if this was true! [/b]</blockquote>
The compounds that they use do not leave a residue and they sure do not use wax on it!!

The body shops I know don't wax the panel for you. They colorsand it, polish it, and then give it back to you. Some will even tell you not to wax for 30 days.

The clearcoat needs time to cure just like the paint underneath.
 
should have stated colorsanded to remove any contaminates in the finished clearcoat such as dust, ditrt, hair etc and fisheye can be sanded and buffed out as you mentioned providing they are not too deep. Fisheye also can come from as in "murphy's law" any and everything! ask any painter. Painting in a booth eliminates most of the problems but you never know.



Most paint shops do not have heated booths but are colorsanding and buffing the work the next day with 1 rubbing compounds 2 polishing compounds 2 a final glaze and not to mention changing pads with each product. Just as you would when buffing out a car. I though this had to do with wax and if it was safe- my answer is yes
 
<span style='font-size: 12px;'>No wax is not safe for fresh paint!!!!

Oil, moisture and silicone are just a couple of things that can caus Fish eyes.
 
<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

<em class='bbc'>Originally posted by terry young [/i]
<strong class='bbc'> not to mention changing pads with each product. Just as you would when buffing out a car
[/b]</blockquote>
What does that have to do with anything?

Of course they are going to change pads with every product!

Yhea, you can use a compound and polish on paint the next day. Why? Because it doesn't leave a residue. They are abrasives. You put them on, work them down, and take them off. They do NOT leave anything residue on the paint that seals it in!

Wax will seal paint in and prevent it from curing properly.

I've worked with automotive paint before. I'm sure there are other people here who have working in professional paint shops. They will all say you do NOT WAX fresh paint! Paint takes 30 to cure!

And why did you start a new thread about this?
 
your answer is correct about paint, wax would imbed and be absorbed into the "paint" if it was just a basecoat only application, such as emamel inwhich there is no clearcoat protection if appiled prior to 30 days. As mentioned prior, a basecoat / clearcoat system, the clearcoat protects the basecoat below it from uv rays and other harmfull elements and yes the clearcoat can absorb some of the wax from microscropic pinholes in the clearcoat itself - mainly on repaints. And to point out, you will never you see urathane basecoat, which is applied to todays autos without clearcoat for the reason above.



You ask why i started this thread, I replied to a question about wax on "new finished paint" and pointed out about how quickly a panel can be preped on and stated it was safe to use wax on fresh "finshes". In my case as I do bumper repair, the clear I use states the clearcoat can be buffed on in 40 minutes if forced dried (via heat lamp) 24 hours if air dried. Here in so ca, I have done it in 40 minutes or less with the 90 degree outside temp. and the heat lamp! The directions on the clear states on how to buff out the panel no mention of not to use wax for 30 days



So to make everone happy wait your 30 days to wax and what have you. But don't tell the new car dealer you just applied your best "wax" to the new car you just preped if you are doing new car prep. As we all know that the new finish on the factory paint has been heat cured or look at all the problems that would happen if all waited 30 days to protect the "clearcoat finish"!
 
your answer is correct about paint, wax would imbed and be absorbed into the "paint" if it was just a basecoat only application, such as emamel inwhich there is no clearcoat protection if appiled prior to 30 days. As mentioned prior, a basecoat / clearcoat system, the clearcoat protects the basecoat below it from uv rays and other harmfull elements and yes the clearcoat can absorb some of the wax from microscropic pinholes in the clearcoat itself - mainly on repaints. And to point out, you will never you see urathane basecoat, which is applied to todays autos without clearcoat for the reason above.



You ask why i started this thread, I replied to a question about wax on "new finished paint" and pointed out about how quickly a panel can be preped on and stated it was safe to use wax on fresh "finshes". In my case as I do bumper repair, the clear I use states the clearcoat can be buffed on in 40 minutes if forced dried (via heat lamp) 24 hours if air dried. Here in so ca, I have done it in 40 minutes or less with the 90 degree outside temp. and the heat lamp! The directions on the clear states on how to buff out the panel no mention of not to use wax for 30 days



So to make everone happy wait your 30 days to wax and what have you. But don't tell the new car dealer you just applied your best "wax" to the new car you just preped if you are doing new car prep. As we all know that the new finish on the factory paint has been heat cured or look at all the problems that would happen if all waited 30 days to protect the "clearcoat finish"!
 
agreeded, only my point of view! Of what I have done and observed in the last 4 years painting of over 3000 items at the whoresale dealers (auto dealers) and that's a whole new subject - gotta go do my whoresaling, late
 
Factory paint can be waxed soon after the paint job-they are usually baked at 550 degrees. Repainted cars are different-due to the tires, battery, hoses, etc, they cannot be baked at high temperatures-most shops give them an hour at about 160 degrees or so, which means the paint needs time to cure before you seal it with wax. You can polish it every day if you want, but most shops will tell you not to wax for 30-90 days.



One of my clients owns a body shop in Dallas, and it is consistantly one of the highest rated shops in town. He uses a downdraft paint booth and Spies-Hecker paints (Mercedes Benz factory paint), and when he fixed my car (and yes, basecoat and clearcoat), he told me in no uncertain terms to not wax for 90 days-and this was in the summer where temperatures routinely exceed 100 degrees. He knows I am a detailer and like to keep my own car polished and waxed-but he said the paint will not cure properly if I seal it. I polished it 1 to 2 times a week and then used Final Inspection on it for some protection, then after 3 months, I waxed it. After nearly 2 years, the paint looks incredibly wet and shiny.



Sorry, but I am going to listen to a long time paint and body man who owns one of the highest rated body shops in Dallas when he tells me how to take care of my freshly repainted front end.
 
Good answer scott - talked to a friend who is in the paint biz some 20 + years after I gave my response and view on wax. She said the same thing. Factory is ok, repaints a no no. The reason it's possible to get solvent "pop" ie pinholes in the clearcoat. To my knowledge, I have never had this problem but will change my ways. Maybe the question should of been what type of new clearcoat finish factory and or refinish. To all I stand corrected
 
Terry-the guy at the shop knew I would be eager to wax my car--but he also made it clear I should wait until the paint was 100% cured. Glad I waited...but also wish I could have afforded the additonal $1500-2000 to reshoot my entire car plus another 7-10 days of a rental car. His repaint of the front end of my car is simply stunning. The color match is very good, especially since my paint is metallic, but what he painted is almost completely devoid of orange peel.
 
This is true on repaints - very little or no orange peel, do to colorsanding and buffing to remove the above and any imperfections. Most of the time the repaint looks better than factory finish! So when buying a used car, check for this for any body damage. gone
 
i have been around body shops and detailing for over 20 years. you never put wax on a freshly painted car. paint/clear coat expels gases and chemicals during the cureing process. puting wax on the paint before this is done holds the gases in causing the paint to peel or flake off. 30 days??? not in my shop or any body shop iv ever been aroun. policey in my shop and many others is 90 days. there is huge diff. between wax and buffing compound or glaze. yeah if your useing a 1 step cleaner there probably is much diff. but true compound is safe for use on fresh paint. why do you think so many top companies put right on the bottle "body shop safe". as far as new cars, auto makers have millions of dollars in equiptment that go into bulding a vehicle includeing what use to cure the paint. you cant compare your $30.00 halogen lamp to what a auto maker uses to cure a vehicles paint.
 
I think s.wax had all the right answers and I do carry a infared heat lamp not holagen heat lamps, now that you mentioned it. And of coarse the auto builders have million $$$ equiptment for spraying, curing and what have you. As I mentioned before never had a problem on any bumpers I colorsanded and buffed and if I did use wax at all; the bumpers if I did use any wax were mainly dark colored to achive the highest shine possible. If there were any problems, it either was unnoticed or maybe at a later date there might be problems. As I said before, I standed corrected.



this subject is old news - didn't need to rip me a new poop hole guys! I thought this was a user friendly forum
 
i wasnt ripping you "a knew poop hole". i apollogize if i came on a bit strong. the post want meant to be that way. i was just trying to put an end to the confusion. so again i apollogize for coming on to strong.



sean...
 
I was called upon to fix a bumper scuff. Buffed the damaged area and everything turned out fine, except for a pea size portion where paint had chipped off. I used touch up paint from the dealer. Added two coats. My question is about buffing this touched up area. Is there anything that one can do to make it look it a bit better? Picture is a bit grainy but you can see the area where I applied touch-up paint.


bumper.jpg
 
Great job at fixing this !

Hard to really see the chip clearly, but it would always look better if the paint in the chip was at the level of the surrounding paint.

Sometimes, it can be carefully either sanded wet, down just a tad, to knock off the edge line around the chip, and buffed out, or just buffed out carefully after its dry and polished.

What does the Client say? Is he ok with the work as it is? If so, leave it..

Good luck !
Dan F
 
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