Bill N application of Klasse SG

J

jab

New member
How long does the actual bonding of SG take to actualy addhere to the paint? Does taking it off immediatly allow for the bonding to take place, or is it better to wait until the bonding has occured? Who knows? I do agree, that Bills method of apply and wipe off really works. I just question that SG bieng a polimer, wich can act differently than a wax as far as bonding time. I just wish that Klasse would represent this product better with more detailed information. I have called them, and for such a good product that they have, they seem to be clueless on the correct answers to these questions. Anyways, thanks Bill for giving us your inpute. I was just about ready to give up on Klasse SG...
 
I have the same questions, if it take 24 hrs to cure than how is any of it bonding to the paint if youjust wipe it right off. I just completed a 2nd layer of SG with thw WOWO method and it seem to give me this nagging feeling as I was doing it. Do anyone know the longevity of this method? And if you use the WOWO method, are you putting on as much protection as we think?



Just my ramblings . . .

blue
 
jab said:
How long does the actual bonding of SG take to actualy addhere to the paint? Does taking it off immediatly allow for the bonding to take place, or is it better to wait until the bonding has occured? Who knows? I do agree, that Bills method of apply and wipe off really works. I just question that SG bieng a polimer, wich can act differently than a wax as far as bonding time. I just wish that Klasse would represent this product better with more detailed information. I have called them, and for such a good product that they have, they seem to be clueless on the correct answers to these questions. Anyways, thanks Bill for giving us your inpute. I was just about ready to give up on Klasse SG...
Click to expand...



Jab, blue,



Let me ask youboth a question. Why do you think that using a wet towel to remove your SG after an hour dry time is so much better??? You do realize that polymers actually require 1 WEEK to fully cure, and not 24 hours. 24 hours is the MINIMUM time required. 24 hrs is what is advertised. This is because there are too many impatient turtle wax detailiers on this board. Gawd forbid they wait a week. Too many ppl want instant gratification. My point being that by introducing moisture into your SG by way of a WET towel before it has FULLY cured (1 WEEK) you are actually compromising your SG. Yes, it's true. That's one of the reasons why I never liked the idea of using the wet towel method. And I feel my claims are justified based on how my SG reacted when I did use the wet towel method. I ended up switching to using a dry app to apply, waiting one hour then removing with a DRY towel ONLY, no damp towel used - search for my name to see why I don't like the damp/dry method. This resolved the problem I had with my SG. But this method was a bear to do, so that's when I came up with WOO.



The fact is, your paint can only accept a certain amount of wax or sealant. This amount that is accepted does not change with the amount of time the product is left to dry. p21s requires that it be buffed off immediately after application. Does this mean that there is no wax on your paint?? Of course not. I think we all know that there is protection left behind. Why do you think that p21s says to remove immediately? Because it makes the product easier to remove. Conversely, blitz wax needs to sit on your car for about 20 mins (or until it hazes). Does this mean there is more blitz on your paint?? No. One grand suggests lettng it haze in order to make it easier to remove. Blitz is a bear to buff- off if removing to soon. Let's look at zaino. They recco letting it dry prior to removal. Why?? Again because it is easier to remove. Letting the z bake on your paint in the sun makes it a breaze to take off.



Have you spotted the common thread in those three examples?? I hope so.



Removing klasse immediately makes the SG easier to remove. Does this mean there is no sg left? Of course not. Just because klasse is a polymer, it does not change anything.



In my experience SG dries rather quickly. When I applied it to a panel and then went to answer my phone, it was a pain to remove after only a couple of minutes of drying. This is one of the things that tells me that there is a great deal of SG left after wiping immediately. I believe the layer beneath the wiped off residue has dried and is present on the paint. Waiting longer only makes the excess more difficult to remove, but IMHO does not help the base bond better.



My experience with WOO...



I applied three layers of SG spaced 1 week apart at the beginning of august to two of my cars. One of the cars was topped with blitz a week after the third coat. All applications of SG were done using WOO. So far my SG has looked, felt and protected as with the previous method I was using (dry app dry towel)



I've taken both cars thru a touchless wash at my local gas station (it's getting colder) and my SG is still going strong.



I see no problems whatsoever with durability, shine, etc.



Have no fears my friends. Have faith in WOO. It works as advertised.



Bill. :xyxthumbs
 
Agreed. That's why I never liked the wet-towel or QD method with Klasse. Exposing it to water should stop the crosslinking process, and that's where IMO that awful SG haze comes from. Speaking of Zaino, I'm curious why Sal recommends, "Z-6 can be used immediately after removing Z-2 or Z-5 or right before applying the next coat of Z-2 or Z-5. Most of my customers prefer to use Z-6 both, before and after Z-2 or Z-5 for that extra gloss boost."



For ZFX, that's not a problem. Or perhaps we're trusting Ron Ketcham's words too much?





BillNorth said:
Jab, blue,



Let me ask youboth a question. Why do you think that using a wet towel to remove your SG after an hour dry time is so much better??? You do realize that polymers actually require 1 WEEK to fully cure, and not 24 hours. 24 hours is the MINIMUM time required. 24 hrs is what is advertised. This is because there are too many impatient turtle wax detailiers on this board. Gawd forbid they wait a week. Too many ppl want instant gratification. My point being that by introducing moisture into your SG by way of a WET towel before it has FULLY cured (1 WEEK) you are actually compromising your SG. Yes, it's true. That's one of the reasons why I never liked the idea of using the wet towel method. And I feel my claims are justified based on how my SG reacted when I did use the wet towel method. I ended up switching to using a dry app to apply, waiting one hour then removing with a DRY towel ONLY, no damp towel used - search for my name to see why I don't like the damp/dry method. This resolved the problem I had with my SG. But this method was a bear to do, so that's when I came up with WOO.



The fact is, your paint can only accept a certain amount of wax or sealant. This amount that is accepted does not change with the amount of time the product is left to dry. p21s requires that it be buffed off immediately after application. Does this mean that there is no wax on your paint?? Of course not. I think we all know that there is protection left behind. Why do you think that p21s says to remove immediately? Because it makes the product easier to remove. Conversely, blitz wax needs to sit on your car for about 20 mins (or until it hazes). Does this mean there is more blitz on your paint?? No. One grand suggests lettng it haze in order to make it easier to remove. Blitz is a bear to buff- off if removing to soon. Let's look at zaino. They recco letting it dry prior to removal. Why?? Again because it is easier to remove. Letting the z bake on your paint in the sun makes it a breaze to take off.



Have you spotted the common thread in those three examples?? I hope so.



Removing klasse immediately makes the SG easier to remove. Does this mean there is no sg left? Of course not. Just because klasse is a polymer, it does not change anything.



In my experience SG dries rather quickly. When I applied it to a panel and then went to answer my phone, it was a pain to remove after only a couple of minutes of drying. This is one of the things that tells me that there is a great deal of SG left after wiping immediately. I believe the layer beneath the wiped off residue has dried and is present on the paint. Waiting longer only makes the excess more difficult to remove, but IMHO does not help the base bond better.



My experience with WOO...



I applied three layers of SG spaced 1 week apart at the beginning of august to two of my cars. One of the cars was topped with blitz a week after the third coat. All applications of SG were done using WOO. So far my SG has looked, felt and protected as with the previous method I was using (dry app dry towel)



I've taken both cars thru a touchless wash at my local gas station (it's getting colder) and my SG is still going strong.



I see no problems whatsoever with durability, shine, etc.



Have no fears my friends. Have faith in WOO. It works as advertised.



Bill. :xyxthumbs
Click to expand...
 
BW said:
Agreed. That's why I never liked the wet-towel or QD method with Klasse. Exposing it to water should stop the crosslinking process, and that's where IMO that awful SG haze comes from. Speaking of Zaino, I'm curious why Sal recommends, "Z-6 can be used immediately after removing Z-2 or Z-5 or right before applying the next coat of Z-2 or Z-5. Most of my customers prefer to use Z-6 both, before and after Z-2 or Z-5 for that extra gloss boost."



For ZFX, that's not a problem. Or perhaps we're trusting Ron Ketcham's words too much?
Click to expand...



You bring up a good point about Zaino. But the fact is, Sal is the man behind the product. He knows Zaino better than anyone. If he says using Z6 is ok, then I trust him. There may be more to it than we realize. z6 may not be of the exact same chemical makeup of z2/z5. There may be provisions in the formula of z6 that allow it to be used on an uncured z2/z5'd surface. Who knows for sure, except Sal??



I don't necessarily think we 'trust' Ron K too much. I don't think it has anything to do with that at all. It's just a simple case of polymer products being slightly different from eachother. I think what Ron has told us about the basic chemistry is correct, and should be adhered to as closely as possible unless otherwise stated by the original formulator. In zaino's case it's Sal, but for klasse, we have no one. That's why I'm listening to Ron. And so far he has not let me down. :bow



Bill. :xyxthumbs
 
One newbie's take on this issue: I've put two coats of SG on my car using Bill's method. It is easy as hell to do, but the car has come out looking great. I'm a believer!
 
I used Bill North's wipe-on-wipe-off method. I applied two coats, one week apart, and am getting ready to put on a third coat next week.



Check out some of Bill's threads. He gives great instructions, and they work well.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top