Another Vintage sample on ebay

The last sample of Vintage I've seen on ebay went in the $400 range IIRC. I'm guessing it's from the same seller but not sure.
 
That's exactly his deal. He's sold 2 other samples in the $100-$150 range that can be easily seen from eBay feedback.



That's gotta be violating the terms of the lifetime supply...
 
DavidB said:
What a scheme... buy a lifetime supply for $1100 and sell it off 4oz at a time.
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I guees thats the discount of buying bulk :faint:



although you could look at it this way, I want to try vintage, I dont want to spend 2g on it just to try it. I can spend 300 try it. If i like it then i can decide to upgrae, if I dont I just saved 1700 and can sell off the sample I have
 
XRL said:
That's exactly his deal. He's sold 2 other samples in the $100-$150 range that can be easily seen from eBay feedback.



That's gotta be violating the terms of the lifetime supply...
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I have always wondered about the terms of a life timerefill. I have never signed anything saying I wont give it away or that I wont sell it. When I purchased it (which may have changed since then) all that the website said was lifetime refills. no astricks no bullets or side points. Just "life time refills"

having said that I have also heard zymol asking ppl to remove auctions such as the one mentioned in this thread as it violates the terms. so I dont know



I have never sold my vintage, I have no desire, I like it enough I dont mind the price tag. Its a sunk cost at this point. due to this I have never had an issue with zymol and not refilling (even though my first refill only took 3 months)



I would be very interested to hear from a lawyer to hear what the legal aspects of selling would be. Is zymol able to cancel the refills? if they do what can be done? are you in the clear as no contract was signed? perhaps a lawyer can tune in.



and sorry to hijack the thread, def not my intention when I came in.. just seemed to happen
 
What's the difference in selling "on the car" or selling a portion? If you buy the product and you're a professional detailer, does that mean you can't apply it to your customer's car, because technically that is selling the product.
 
DavidB said:
What's the difference in selling "on the car" or selling a portion? If you buy the product and you're a professional detailer, does that mean you can't apply it to your customer's car, because technically that is selling the product.
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I agree 100%. I dont see how they are any diffrent, however I am sure there are others who view it diffrently
 
I guess it's a matter of how often they'll refill it. I had seen one of those lifetime refills say you only get a refill every 4 or 6 months.



Damn good idea if you're a pro and they'll refill you as much as you want though. If you used a tub a month, it'd pay for itself in a short time.



But on the other hand, I could see why Zymol wouldn't want it to be like that. That 2k is probably supposed to cover 20+ years of waxing, and if you go through it at $100 a month(a tub's worth we'll say) they're going to lose money pretty quick on that deal.
 
I think users should be able to do with whatever products they purchase. Who's fault is it for offering an overpriced wax with a lifetime supply? Certainly not the customer who purchases it.



Maybe Zymol should have been a little more intelligent about marketing their overpriced waxes.
 
DavidB said:
What's the difference in selling "on the car" or selling a portion? If you buy the product and you're a professional detailer, does that mean you can't apply it to your customer's car, because technically that is selling the product.
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Well, Zymol went after a number of professional detailers and insisted that, in order to use their products, they must purchase their supplies directly from them and participate in their training program which runs about $10,000 (or some other insane number).



Here's your linky:



Zymol have lost the plot - Detail University - Auto Detailing Forum



This is Detail University's claim to fame. :lol
 
XRL said:
But on the other hand, I could see why Zymol wouldn't want it to be like that. That 2k is probably supposed to cover 20+ years of waxing, and if you go through it at $100 a month(a tub's worth we'll say) they're going to lose money pretty quick on that deal.
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You're assuming that bag of pig fat they call wax costs a lot to make. If it costs $10 per refill (not including shipping), I'd be surprised. Assuming 100% markup on cost, that means a buyer needs to get 50 refills to make it worth it.
 
yep - in the Uk you cant 'sell' Zymol as a pro detailer without being authorised.



In ads for Vintage it has "Not for Trade use" shown. Now how they can actually enforce that is a good question, but it is clear they have T&C about refills which arent made public and they also state all purchases are subject to US approval before they accepted.



I actually really like the wax, and its done over 3 months of winter weather so far on my hood, and still beads almost like day 1, but £1800 is crazy, especially when the 'free refills' will cost you £250+ for shipping etc :wall:
 
Very true. It may cost them very little to produce. Not having that information it's all conjecture.



I could understand not wanting their wax to be used by any detailer who orders it. You're talking about a product they're billing as the best in the world, they don't want inexperienced detailers soiling their good name by applying it on cars whose paint hasn't been corrected, etc.



Sort of like BMW's M division (i think). It used to be that if you bought a new M (or whatever it was) you got a trip to their training school with it, where they would teach you how to drive. Most just see it as a perk, but the clever see it as a way to make sure that their cars are driven by slightly more experienced drivers, making the cars look better too.
 
I would have to agree a bit with Mike (Calgary Detail) in that Zymol probably doesn't care what you do with the wax (after they've garnered the entry fee); Their issue could be making a profit from the wax by a method of marketing the sold portion(s) of wax that wouild either copy Zymol's program of marketing their products and/or be viewed as a use of the company's name or trademark material in the absence of a signed agreement. I am not sure how an advertisement on the Bay would fall within Zymol's range of acceptability.



Zymol is legendary, though, with protecting their rights against competitors that they deem to have "stepped on their toes" with what they may see as unfair advertising. Zymol is also well known for scolding and banning their "customers" for unwarranted use of their intellectual rights for the purpose of making a profit......and other activitites which irritates them that I've heard of from time to time.



From a user standpoint, I would think that samples should be available to potential customers that are curious about such a pricey item as Vintaaaaaghhhe, so that a fair comparison between rivaling products could be made. Not having samples of Vintage available and buying the wax outright is a big gamble for a taker that isn't familiar with it or any of their premium waxes. Perhaps Zymol should consider marketing (or selectively supplying) small amounts of their "good stuff" to some curious potential buyers. It could be a way of answering many of the ebay sellers (I doubt it myself, but it would be a nice thing to have IMO).
 
I think that would be a great idea for them. Even if it was just a tiny tiny portion, like a crayon or something, enough to test it on your hood and see if it's really worth it.



But then again, let's be realistic, they're not selling a $2000 wax, they're selling a $200 wax and $1800 in name and exclusivity.



Once you use any decent wax, the return from stepping up gets lower and lower. Many people find it difficult to tell between a lower priced wax like M26, to something in a P21S, Wolfgang Fuzion, Dodo Supernatural, or one of these Zymols. The "gains" are no longer equal with the increase in price.



So the samples of Zymol that would be given out or sold might not show enough of a difference to a Dodo Supernatural or Souveran or something like that and keep someone from buying it based on their marketing. They get an edge by making people want it due to its hype and price, so very few people who buy a lifetime supply of it are going to say "it wasn't as good as I expected".
 
^I wouldn't necessarily hold that as true; There have been some that have bought Vintage (one or two testified on this board....and I am trusting that this was the case for them) and for one reason or another were not satisfied with it.



It goes without saying that the performance of a wax is at best a subjective trait, when that wax's quality is judged by individuals with differing expectations. The very same thing could be said in viewing a P21s or a Natty's against an otc Mothers, or NXT or Megs. The issue with the Zymol products (and this is from an avid user) is that many of them are priced out of an ideal range of comparison with other products, that in buying a zymol product becomes a purchase of chance. This is why I would advocate that Zymol should re-consider marketing smaller samples of their products for curious buyers.



IMO.....you are going to know if a product satisfied your wants and needs regardless of what you paid for it; And if one paid a "million" for it......and it either retuned no results or returned a marginal result (and would you not compare it to other products?), the very last thing anyone should do is to not say that it didn't produce.
 
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