AIO necessary after Menzerna IP/FP??

A

AudiOn19s

New member
I"m going to break down and finally use that PC that I purchased about a month ago this weekend. My question is this. I plan on using Menzerna IP (yellow pad) then FP (white pad) followed by Zaino and probably topped with P21S.



I've read many threads where people are Using AIO after the Menzerna combination and before Zaino but I donot understand why. AIO is generally used for it's cleaning abilityies from what i can tell BUT if the surface has just been prepped then what use does the AIO really have? As stated above I fully intend on going straight from the Menzerna FP straight to Zaino but have been interested in how many seem to use AIO as a base for even their Zaino.



So...is there any real reason to use AIO after the Menzerna and before the Zaino...or can I feel confident in going straight to Zaino after polishing?



Thanks in advance
 
p.s. this isn't really my first post but thanks to the hackers I've had to start over here twice...I have been lurking here for awhile now BUT finally decided to sign up and post not too long back..unfortunatly I chose the wrong time as the hackers apparently didn't want me to be part of this community :(
 
If nothing more, the AIO is a "for the hell of it" step, apply it before Zaino just for fun. It does leave behind a bit of a sealant finish, why it's original intent was to act as a base for SG
 
Any thoughts on weather or not the AIO will create any depth underneith The Zaino...or is it another product just like Zaino that's nearly optically perfect?
 
I'm gonna bring this back to the top one more time for a related (somewhat) question.



On a car with no prep...would it be wise(er) to use AIO as a base for Zaino Z2 rather than Zaino Z5. I'm assuming yes because AIO has cleaners in it whereas Z5 is apparently just Z2 with a filler in it?
 
You won't need Z5 if you've completed a good finish cleanup with FP and your PC. I would go with FP and Z2. Use the additive for the first coat of Z2. Use the IP only where your finish needs attention. Why grind down clear coat where there isn't a problem? I'm a noob though, so there may be alternate views.
 
I'd apply a layer of AIO just for my peace of mind for UV protection, especially on a car that's outside all day. Unless you were using a polish that contained fillers, AIO won't hurt, imo.
 
I would recommend you use the FP at #6 on your PC with a finishing pad. The intent is to no longer cut clearcoat, but to burnish it to the highest possible gloss.



AIO after any polishing is a good idea IMHO because it contains cleaners as well as sealants. The cleaners will remove all the fillers/oils/waxes that polishes before FP might have laid down. The super clean paint will then provide the best base for the appearance products you put down on top of it.



You can also apply the AIO using a finishing pad at #6 with the PC. I recommed using the EO W&S with the AIO as it helps to keep it really realy thin (the key to success with the K-twins). Since the AIO is so thin:

(a) it will be very easy to remove with a clean MF

(b) if you see streaking, mist with EO W&S and wipe again with a clean MF

(c) Do entire vehicle twice to ensure you didn't miss a spot.

Do one body panel (or half a panel) at a time and IMMEDIATELY wipe off with a clean MF.



I see your intent is to Zaino after the AIO. Maybe wait 24 hours before the Z. If however you decide to use SG, then apply the first SG layer immediately after the AIO - a panel (or half) at a time and again IMMEDATELY wipe down with a lean MF.



Research the "BillNorth" Klasse application method before starting. He is the guru of WOWO (wipe-on, wipe-off)
 
FP with finishing pad, that something ive never heard about but sounds like I should give it a try. Good advice on it.
 
I love AIO (finishing pad) as my last step before laying down my Zaino. Not necessary after IP and FP ( both water-based and non-filling) but I feel more confortable with the AIO's final cleaning of the surface prior to starting Zaino.

Another alternative if you are a Z1 user is to work some Z1 (by hand) into finish after FP. This layer of Z1 should be undetectable (very,very, very, very, very thin application) and Z1 cleans the surface extremely well . Both AIO and Z1 add a little wetness (depth) to the final polished finish from my experience.



Try AIO on one panel and one without. If no discernable difference, skip the AIO step.



I do not wait 24 hrs after AIO has been applied. I proceed straight to my coat(s) of Zaino.



I would not top with a carnuaba sooner than 3-4 days after Zaino application.



Hope this helps.
 
blkZ28conv....That's EXACTLY the response that I was looking for. Seeing as though my A4 is also black I'll try a little side by side comparison as well just to see.



AIO with a finishing pad...do you then also apply Zaino with a finishing pad OR by hand?
 
AudiOn19s,

I always apply Z polishes by hand, but PC application works very well also and actually makes it easier to apply a thin even coat when first starting out (not you). After a few applications the hand method achieves similiar results. Both methods use about the same amount of polish.



Why by hand?

The time saved by PC is lost in the pad cleaning chore later. Also I rather use a MF/cotton wax applicator slightly moistened with Z6 or water to apply. Just throw these item in next detailing towel wash load. :D

Z polish enhanced with ZFX tends to hardened the foam pads even when cleaned immediately after using.



Another plus for using AIO is that it actually "seals" surface and makes for a streak-free initial application. This is important with a black vehicle.



The reason I use the finishing pad is for the chemical cleaning of AIO. Polishing was achieve with IP.

Side note. I always start with a polishing pad when I use IP and only go to a cutting pad if area requires a little more bite. As someone suggested, especially on dark vehicles, be careful with IP and a cutting pad. :xyxthumbs
 
Lets us know the results of your test with and without AIO between FP and Z2.



FP with a PC set to 3.5 and white pad leaves the paint gleaming. Z2 (applied with zfx on the first coat) has UV protection. I suspect that AIO is only extra work if the FP is worked correctly. FP is not difficult to remove with a MF buffing cloth. I'm thinking comments I've read are from folks applying too much or applying on hot finish.



I think Zaino does folks a disservice by advising the steps are to wash, clay Z5 and Z2. The finish prep before sealing is everything and Z5 just doesn't to it. Z5 doesn't remove much dirt, maring, watermarks etc. It hides them and they are back when you clay it off. Meanwhile, the microscratches still catch your eye.



FP is impressive on these problems and even before the sealer or wax is on and shows a deep glossy finish. If it gets even shinier with AIO let us know!
 
I have heard sometime during the last couple of months (on Autopia) that FP done with a rotary is even more impressive than when done with a PC. I haven't done that on my truck (it is between polishings right now), but will be doing a black Lighning over the Labor Day weekend and IT WILL see FP done with a rotary.
 
Gonzo said:
I have heard sometime during the last couple of months (on Autopia) that FP done with a rotary is even more impressive than when done with a PC. I haven't done that on my truck (it is between polishings right now), but will be doing a black Lighning over the Labor Day weekend and IT WILL see FP done with a rotary.
Click to expand...



Please let us know how it goes Gonzo. I love IP with polishing pad by rotary and also plan a project this winter using FP by rotary to see if the effort and the results are worth the chance of burning my paint. :wavey
 
FP or Micro Polish used with a rotary IS the way Menzerna formulated the polish. It's just others that have PC's and tried it that found a way for it to be pretty good with the PC and right pad/pressure.



One last pass with FP and a finish pad at 1000 RPM will burnish the paint. Then you have a mirror once completed. It takes a bit of getting acclimated to Menzerna as it reacts different from other polishes.



As for Zaino, most of us know that the finish HAS to be flawless. Z5 does very little in correction or hiding. Z2 is so damn clear that once applied, it shines up ANY defects! I've done it both ways, hand and PC. For the PC, I use the softest pad (LC Blue) and apply S L O W. Prime the pad with Z6 and off you go.



I have better luck with Poorboys EX-P. Easy as hell to use! Apply and wipe off. Very simple and very glossy.



AIO on a good finish just adds to the work performed as it's a cleaner/polish/sealant in one (AIO). Looks really nice after 24 hours topped with a good caranuba like P21S/S100/Nattys and for black finishes Souveran. The SG can be a PITA. It HAS to be applied thin like Zaino or it's tuff to remove.



To maintain Klasse or other sealants, I've found that the Sonus Spritz works well as a QD gloss enhancer. For just cleaning light dust, Poorboy's S&W.



Regards,

Deanski
 
blkZ28conv...applying Zaino by hand makes perfect sense to me as I've been doing it for several years and feel my technique is pretty good...your reasoning for not applying with a PC makes perfect sense...I was just looking for more reasons to use my recently acquired PC.



To Gonzo, Deanski and others...I cannot thank you enough for your replies. I come looking for a little piece of advise and you were all kind enough to give me answers that were above and beyond what I had expeceted.



Makes me really excited about being a part of this community!!!....I'm glad I found this board.



Andy
 
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